Have you ever wondered what separates everyday people from Olympic champions? Physical ability aside, it’s a concept Dr. Jeff Spencer calls the “Champion Mindset.”
Spencer is one of the world’s foremost performance coaches, and he’s worked with some of the most iconic athletes, entertainers, and business leaders in the world.
In this episode, Dr. Jeff explains how easily our natural mind can get hijacked by fear and doubt and what we can do to regain control. He says it works for gold medal athletes, and it can work for you in life and on the job.
I think you’ll be encouraged by Dr. Jeff’s message that balance matters if we want to show up at our best in all areas of life.
One quick correction: I asked Dr. Jeff to tell the story of British long jumper Greg Rutherford. I called him a high jumper. My bad. Alright, I hope you enjoy my conversation with Dr. Jeff Spencer.
Resources from the episode:
- Connect with Dr. Jeff here and get a free copy of his lesson “How Not To Blow It Right Before You Win.”
- Interested in applying for Dr. Jeff’s Cornerman Elite Performance Coaching? Share your biggest goals and what you stand to lose if you fail – and apply here.
- Follow Dr. Jeff on LinkedIn.
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Transcript
The following transcript is not certified. Although the transcription is largely accurate, in some cases it is incomplete or inaccurate due to inaudible passages or transcription errors. The information contained within this document is for general information purposes only.
Speakers: Dr. Jeff Spencer and Mark Wright
DR. JEFF SPENCER 00:00
But if you do what the champions do, they realize that perfection’s not necessary, and what does matter is that you do the one or two things that have to go right to win. As a matter of fact, the champion’s golden rule is at least by my standards, what I call it, you do the homework and the test is easy. You know that’s how you win gold medals.
MARK WRIGHT 00:20
This is the BEATS WORKING Show. We are on a mission to redeem work. The word, the place, and the way. I’m your host, Mark Wright. Join us at winning the game of work. Welcome to BEATS WORKING on today’s show, have you ever thought about what Olympic athletes do to get ready to compete? I mean, if you think about it, they train for years to compete for sometimes, 11 seconds. So how did they get ready mentally? How did they get ready physically? Today’s guest, Dr. Jeff Spencer, knows what it takes to become a champion. He knew at the age of seven he wanted to be in the Olympics, and he did it. He competed as a cyclist at the age of 21, but then he realized his true calling was coaching. Dr. Jeff has spent his life coaching people to the highest levels in sports, entertainment, and business. What I learned from him is what short circuits us in life and work is the same thing that causes elite athletes and performers to fall short, the exact same thing. In the show notes, be sure to click the link to get Dr. Jeff’s lesson, how not to blow it right before you win. What I also learned from Dr. Jeff is that to truly be a champion, you have to live a balanced life. He cut his professional workload by 90% at one point to become a better dad to his adopted daughter. But I think the most profound thing I learned from talking with Dr. Jeff Spencer is that champions know they don’t have to be perfect to win. One quick correction, I asked Dr. Jeff to tell the story of British long jumper Greg Rutherford. I called him a high jumper ha-ha. For the record, I was a competitive bowler in college. Uh, so my bad on that one, but it’s a fantastic conversation and I hope you enjoy. Dr. Jeff Spencer, welcome to the BEATS WORKING Podcast. It’s great to have you here.
DR. JEFF SPENCER 02:25
Great to be here. Thank you.
MARK WRIGHT 02:27
So, if you know who Dr. Jeff is, you know you are in for a treat. If you don’t know who Dr. Jeff is, I’m just gonna say right now, put on your seatbelt and get ready to change your life. Dr. Jeff is one of the most sought after performance coaches in the world. So, Dr. Jeff, you’ve consulted the likes of Tiger Woods, the rock band, U2, um, Lance Armstrong, Sir Richard Branson. The list is a very long one, but I wanna start with your personal story because I think it says a lot about how you became who you are today. At seven years old, you decided you wanted to compete in the Olympics. Take us back to that moment and how did a seven-year-old, uh, future Dr. Jeff decided I’m gonna be in the Olympics?
DR. JEFF SPENCER 03:08
Yeah, well, you know, as a very physical kid, anything involving running, jumping, throwing, bumping into people or whatever, I was, uh, first in line for, and, uh, I was never competitive against other people. It was really exploring a possibility of what could potentially be into testing the limits. So, I was never motivated by trying to show other people I could do something when they told me I couldn’t, and actually, the Olympics, uh, chose me, actually. I’ve always been a person that doesn’t so much chase my dreams, but I answer the calling and for sure the gravity was there between me and the Olympics. And so, uh, it showed up and I became a faithful advocate of delivering on the promise of doing my side of it, and because of the amazing angels that I had my own life to cultivate my mind and my body and my, uh, physical readiness and mental readiness to play at that level. 10 years later, I actually did become, uh, an Olympian.
MARK WRIGHT 04:03
Uh, Dr. Jeff did, was there a moment that you realized that biking was your superpower?
DR. JEFF SPENCER 04:08
Well, when I was on a bicycle ride with some of the neighborhood, uh, boys that were 8 to 10 years older than myself that had joined a formal bicycle club, they asked me to go run along for a ride. So I borrowed a bike and after a 25-mile ride when I was, uh, like nine. These guys were all pooped out at 16, and I just felt like I was just getting started. So, there was a little bit of a suggestion that there’s something awkward about this that we maybe should pay attention to, and that ultimately led to people recognizing that I did have a different, almost surreal physical capacity on a bicycle, and they had enough trust in me to, uh, be there, to nurture me forward, to be, uh, ultimately an Olympian.
MARK WRIGHT 04:47
Yeah. So, Dr. Jeff, you had a pretty important mentor come into your life, I think, around the age of 18. How was that a turning point, uh, in your life in terms of who you became?
DR. JEFF SPENCER 04:58
Yeah, I actually had three, uh, three angels. The first one was my Olympic coach, actually, who I met when I was 13, and he chose me to come, uh, the invitation from him to join his training group, which was only Olympians and world champions, and he said, Jeff, you know, you’re here at 13, you’re not gonna do our, uh, training program, of course, I’ll tell you what to do, but the reason why I want you here is that I want you to be around the highest level of conversation possible about what it really takes to become an Olympian, and if you have it within you to do that, because I can’t put anything into you but you, if you innately have this and this conversation will awaken something in you to be able to manifest that potential because winning is a learned skill. It’s not something that you’re necessarily born with. So, I owe him a little bit of everything. My, uh, second mentor was the person that I met, uh, when I was 18, and he was 76. And he was a true Renaissance man that was a university-trained metallurgist. He was a World War I correspondent in television, uh, there wasn’t television at that time, but in newspapers. He was a Shakespearean actor, he was an Emmy, uh, award-winning, uh, person that did a documentary about his creative philosophy. He developed an entirely new type of, uh, art glass sculpture. So on and so forth, and what he did, he chose me to be his art, art glass, uh, apprentice to help him create his masterpieces, and what he did when we took our breaks and we took our lunches, he would play classical music to me. He would read the great poets of, uh, throughout the ages to me. He would, uh, also share with me, um, some of the great moments in history because he said, I ne need to fill you up on this stuff which I had a receptivity too that nobody else I knew was exposed to that, and that added a really important soulful component, uh, to, uh, myself and then the final, uh, angel that I had was a, a man of great dignity that was resolved if there ever was a human, uh, person that had been able to reconcile his humanness. And I always wanted to emulate him, and he chose me, and I found out later the reason why he did was he was a World War II concentration camp victim. Exposed to the most, you know, heinous crimes against humanity, you could imagine but he was able to transcend that, and he was able to share that side of me. So those three people were the angels that gave me the assets to be able to compete at the level, uh, as an Olympian, along with some of the other stuff that he ended up doing.
MARK WRIGHT 07:26
Wow. What a beautiful convergence of, of mentorship, right? Yeah.
DR. JEFF SPENCER 07:30
A gift, true gift.
MARK WRIGHT 07:31
How, how did you become a, a consultant? Once, once you, uh, you know, competed in the Olympics and you know, we’re around athletes at a super high level. When did that turn into, I know you, you trained to become a chiropractor, but when, when did people start coming to you and say, Jeff, you’ve gotta, you’ve gotta help me learn this stuff. You’ve got something special.
DR. JEFF SPENCER 07:49
Well, there’s a genesis of this is that, you know, if you’re gonna help people at the highest level possible, you have to have done it yourself. You can’t read books or interview people and be it, it’s not possible. So, my DNA was, uh, and always has been wired towards gold medal mentality, and producing things at the gold medal level. So, I had that master because I was an Olympian. But while I was becoming an Olympian, I was also, uh, completing my, um, work at the University of Southern California where I got my BA in Sports Science. So, I knew how to craft a body that could push. I knew how to craft a body that could stay in the game long enough to develop the capacity for creating the most significant number of, uh, life wins to create a, a memorable legacy and live a life of purpose, uh, and, uh, meaning, and so that’s why people came to me. The athletes wanted to win gold medals, which have helped over 40 athletes win gold medals. I, uh, the business people came to me, said, well, you must know something about becoming a champion and can you help me becoming own champion? So, whether it’s boardroom, locker room, becoming a champion is the same presence of being in, it’s the same type of experiential decision-making that has to go right to be able to play consistently at that level, and the athletes wanted to extend their careers, and they knew that injury prevention and management was a secret to that, and the business people that came to me realized that they don’t wanna die of a heart attack or a stroke in their late thirties or early forties, like they said. Like they saw their same age counterpart. So they asked me, can I help? So, I decided, well, I’m gonna go back to school. I’ll get a primary licensure as a healthcare provider to be able to manage those myself professionally. And so, then I became the guy that, number one, was an Olympian. So, I knew what it took to get to the top and stay there. Number two, I knew how to craft the health and the body to be able to make that happen, and I also knew how to prevent injuries and also help people boost their, uh, wellness capacity so they don’t get sick or injured at an inopportune time. So, people recognized in me that we don’t need 10 experts that know, talk to each other, and create my program. That’s un, undoable, not doable, but we can go to Jeff and because of Jeff’s experience in all this, he can understand what I need to do for myself or my team that’s unique to us, where we can get the most gains in our performance with the least amount of time and effort. So that’s how I got the ear of busy people that play really big games that don’t want too many people involved in their life to slow it down. They want to be able to make quick decisions quickly about what they need to do to get to the top of their games and stay there. So that’s how that all happened.
MARK WRIGHT 10:17
So, the concept at the core of your coaching and your work is, is human mindset versus the champion’s mind. And for our listeners who aren’t familiar with that, it’s basically the struggle, as you’ve explained, the struggle between our natural mind and the mind that we actually want to run our lives, right?
DR. JEFF SPENCER 10:34
I, I would say that really, um, to kind of preface this, I would say that y you know, winning big is not an accident. It’s a very deliberate outcome of specific actions consistently applied, and my observation is, is that you have to be proficient in five different compe, competencies to be able to make that happen. The first of which is the champion’s mind. You have to be able to make really good decisions consistently under pressure. The second rung on the ladder is you have to be able to control your day, because if you can’t control your day, you can’t control your life. Can’t control your life, well then you can’t produce your best legacy or live your best life. The third thing is, is that you have to understand that, you know, winning is a learned behavior, it’s a learned skill, and it’s something anybody can learn, but that’s not something that’s commonly part of any curriculum. The fourth thing competency is you have to be able to peek around the corner and see what’s coming because a lot of the things that blindside us and take us out of the game, or opportunities that show up, that connect exponentially, take us to the next level. We’re not ready for because we just don’t know how to look around the corner and read the tea leaves as to what’s coming, and then the fifth part of that is you have to be able to carry momentum, which is the most prized commodity in the three-dimensional space that we live in. So going back to the champion’s mind, yeah. There’s an ongoing conflict for us as humans because we have a human nature way of responding to life. It’s like a biologic hard wiring where our first initial inclination at every moment is to make sure that we stay in a place of survival and survival, survival decisions cannot get us into the winter circle cause they’re not calibrated towards that, and therefore we also have just a strong impulse and a desire to live a life of distinction and contribution. We all wanna win our gold medal and become our own champions, but we can’t get there through our innate human uh, survival instincts or impulses, and that’s why we have to cultivate a champion’s mind, and the thing that I will say is that a champion’s mind has to be continuously applied to be able to keep the gains in our control over ourselves to win as much as we can to showcase our capacity. It’s not something that you get that self-perpetuates because it’s not a natural state of being. Natural state of being a survival. You can’t become a perennial winner if you’re engaging life through the perspective of survival.
MARK WRIGHT 13:00
So, this struggle between the natural mind and the champion’s mind. I mean, I’m thinking back to childhood and just very pronounced. Even, even as a kid, you’re afraid to, to ask someone to dance at the roller, uh, rink, you know, to, to skate.
DR. JEFF SPENCER 13:12
Ha-ha you too? same thing.
MARK WRIGHT 13:15
You know, and you’re afraid in, in high school to ask that person out because oh, they’ll never say yes to going out on a date with me. I mean, this is something that’s very deeply rooted, isn’t it?
DR. JEFF SPENCER 13:24
Well, yeah, it’s actually biologically hardwired. I mean, we think that it’s programmed into us, and we’re born as a blank slate. That’s not true. You know, we have a reflex capacity that’s hardwired into us, that’s survival based. I mean, there’s gotta be something faster than we can think to jump out of the way of an oncoming car or slip on the ice and your hand knows where to put itself. You know, those are examples of physical biology that are survival based, that are faster than we can think. It’s the same way with psychological survival. If somebody says something to you that you’re taken by surprise by, you don’t like it, how many times have you said something faster than you can think and you thought it was gonna be awesome and it turned out just absolutely to be a disaster. So, we can see that there is something that’s a biology that we didn’t ask for that’s hardwired into us, that’s there to support us in survival, but if we respond to life thinking that we’re gonna live a life of excellence, coming from our survival side, it just is not gonna happen. So there has to be this override by our drive and our desire to become our own champions. It’s the only way that it could be done.
MARK WRIGHT 14:26
So, you’ve consulted some of the top athletes and leaders in the world, and I’m just curious, where do those conversations begin and is there a common block that sort of, you know, that you see over and over?
DR. JEFF SPENCER 14:37
The conversation begins as early in life as possible so that we set people up to understand the differences of, uh, our human biology impulse to survive, which can’t really take us to where we would, would like to get to and from those conscious decisions and actions that are applied based on what history tells us to be true, that if done will take us to where we want to get to because many of those things are very contrary, and then seem unorthodox. The, the general way that humanity looks at certain things, but historically tells us that it just happens to be what it is. That may seem a bit contrary, and that’s where the courage comes into it. You know, do you really have the courage to do what the herd doesn’t do that history has proven to get us to where we want to go because you’re, you’re risking a certain level of. Um, societal, uh, exclusion, you know, being ostracized from their group because you’re different. So that’s where the courage part comes into this, and through application over time, we start to realize that there’s a whole other capacity that we have to really take control of our life to be able to steer it deliberately and purposely towards our bigger future where we can perform at a highest level in the areas of expertise that, that we’re naturally born with.
MARK WRIGHT 15:51
So, I heard you say in an interview when the stakes get high, the human mindset asks, what do I have to lose? And the champion’s, uh, mind says, what do I have to gain? And I think there’s a, a story that you’ve told that really captures this. You consulted, uh, a high jumper from the UK named Greg Rutherford. Who was already performing at a really high level, but then started to melt down and they called you. And, uh, I think this story is so fascinating because we assume that people at that level are, sort of just have this iron-clad mind that is, is not susceptible to this stuff.
DR. JEFF SPENCER 16:27
Now we, we all have the conflict 24 hours a day. We feel the restlessness of being uncertain, then confident, should I do this? And then should I do that? I mean, that’s the, the battle, it goes on every day for control over our decision-making between our survival, hardwired biology impulses in our champion’s, deliberate mind that can apply the things that have to go right to win your gold medal, and so Greg was leading the World Championship. They came to me two and a half weeks before the Olympic final and said, Greg’s melting down. What do we do? He is got the best coaches, he’s got the best equipment, has the best, uh, sports psychologist, but yet he’s starting to mentally unravel. What do we do? I talked to Greg, and I said, Greg, this is really simple. You need to understand something here, is that you’re here at a place once in a lifetime opportunity, and you’re starting mentally unravel. You’re disconnected from your body, but this is not difficult to, uh, unravel here and we still got two and a half weeks to do this, but you better listen up and listen to what I have to say, and I said that you’re now operating up, up from your fear-based survival biology, and you guys mistakenly think that you have to put in a perfect jump to win the Olympics. And so, you think the way that you deal with that is that you need to make a contingency for every possible scenario that could happen, and when you do that, you could put in the perfect jump. But we know your fear-based, uh, mindset. Human mindset will always convince you that there’s a detail that you haven’t found, that you put all your confidence in that will help you and you must have to be able to win the Olympic gold medal. Therefore, it probably doesn’t exist. So, you’ve already lost. But if you do, what the champions do, they realize the perfection’s not necessary, and what does matter is that you do the one or two things that have to go right to win, and in this case here, Greg, you just need to go back to the warmup that you, you’re used to doing because your body’s familiar with that. When your body is around something it’s familiar with, then it feels comfortable and it’s gonna perform for you. But when you start to change things, you start to shorten up your warm-up. You try to make it longer, then the body gets confused. It doesn’t know what to do. So it runs into the cave. It rolls the rock over the front, front. It doesn’t want to come out and doesn’t wanna play. So just please go back to your normal warm-up, and the second thing is, the first four steps to your run-up, determine the speed to hit the board, to get the lift, to win the long jump. That’s all you need to do those two things. Instant gold metal. Said, you’re kidding me. Said, no, I I’m not. We’re looking at historical evidence and data that tells us that that’s true. I know it’s hard to embrace it because your fear-based survival impulses are telling you another story, but it’s not gonna work, and so I said, this is all you need to do. You either trust me or you don’t. The choice is yours. He said, well, I trust you sorta. But I’ll do it. I said, well, that’s great, and so, um, you know, two and a half weeks later, he did only what I requested of him. Boom. Won the gold medal, uh, which is amazing. Cried his eyes out, you know, in the podium getting his gold medal because, you know, he fought the fight that we all fight day in and day out. Are we gonna go live a life based on our fear? Let it control our decision-making. Or we gonna take control of this and apply what has to go right? That history tells us it has to go right to become our own champion, start to believe in ourselves, and start to do these repeated, uh, successes that create a massive legacy that can also teach other people how it’s done, and then Greg went on to win the World Championship, he won the Commonwealth Games, he, uh, won the European games. He won everything that there was to win, and the single reason why he did it is that he had the courage to embrace the champion’s mind and do the two things that had to go right, rather than stress about everything that could go wrong.
MARK WRIGHT 19:57
That’s such a great story, great story, and as you were telling that story, Jeff, it, it reminds me of even like, uh, football teams, they’ll get to the Super Bowl and instead of just like handing it to the best running back in, in the league to, to run in for a touchdown and win the Super Bowl, they try a new play. And how, how often do we change our game plan when the stakes are so high?
DR. JEFF SPENCER 20:18
Classic. As a matter of fact, uh, Mark, if people wanna go to www.drjeffspencer.com and one of the gifts that I give people is a paper that I wrote about this very thing. It’s like, how not to blow it just before you win. That’s exactly the name of what it is. Please take the time everybody get that. I think you find it valuable, but because I see this all the time, you know when people are prepared to do it. And literally how you prepare is how you perform, but when you start to make it too important, you start changing things. It isn’t part of your fabric yet, and because it’s a fear-based, um, impulse to try to do something different, to try to get the advantage rather than just to show up and do what you’re prepared for. This is actually human nature and it’s completely predictable that this would happen, and it should not happen at all but sometimes what we know people say about history is that we don’t learn anything from history. No matter how many times we try it, it’s never gonna work. It’s never worked and it never will work this time.
MARK WRIGHT 21:15
Jeff, I’d like you to speak directly to maybe a businessperson listening. So, let’s, let’s think about a scenario where the stakes are really high. Let’s say they’re walking into a sales meeting and they’re pitching a huge client that if they land this account, it’s gonna change the trajectory of their life and the company, and so stakes are super high. What’s your best advice to that businessperson? When they start looking at, okay, what do I do? I’ve got this huge, huge thing, and I don’t wanna blow it.
DR. JEFF SPENCER 21:42
Well, the first thing is to, to recognize why are you there? I mean, if the client didn’t think you had something of value to them, you would not even be asked to be there. So, you have to ask yourself, you know, what do I think about this? Well, that’s a question you should ask yourself. That’s what I have my clients to. Well, I think that I have the solution to their problem, and that’s why I’m here. You know. Okay, great. Well, we sort of demystified the apprehension on that side of it. The second question to ask is like, well, who am I? Well, I’m qualified. I’ve been in the business for 30 years. Nobody knows the business like I do. Again, I can help this person. They’re lucky to know me, and then the final thing is, is that when the door opens and you have to enter the room there. You just think about the first thing that you have to say, don’t try to go through all the scenarios or possibilities like Greg was confronted with, to win the gold medal. You only think about, what’s the one word that needs to come outta your mouth? That has to go right where then all of your preparation can be, uh, spewed forward to be able to crush the opportunity because what you’ve got is already there. It’s just your job to get out of the way. It all starts with that first domino that falls, then everything else rolls off the tongue.
MARK WRIGHT 22:54
That’s great advice. Um, Dr. Jeff, I think we all have a perception that successful people are not susceptible to falling victim to the human mindset, but as you just mentioned, we, we really are, you were hired by one of the most iconic rock bands in history, U2 because they were having some problems and, and, uh, I’d love you to tell that story and, and what was the key to what you taught them?
DR. JEFF SPENCER 23:16
Well, first and foremost there, there are no exemptions or free passes from the battle that we all fight. If you really saw what happens behind the scenes is that every prolific achiever that does something of high significance, especially, uh, in the presence of other people like U2. For example, there was 131 concerts over 18 months. It was a world tour. I mean, that’s a lot of time and a lot of effort. I mean, you have to train for that like you would for the Olympics. It’s that vigorous and every concert that you do, everybody expects you to show up and play as if it were your first, uh, you know, concert. So again, that’s a matter of number one, not feeling the compulsion to try to over prepare, to be too perfect, to perform up to everybody else’s expectations. You have to really manage your energy over time. You have to learn to not obsess about certain things that really don’t matter. Uh, you need to trust in your preparation to be able to deliver. Uh, you have to be a great teammate and know how to communicate with your band uh, members, we need to give allowances and grace to ourselves and others for shortcomings. When fuse has get a little bit short in claustrophobic circumstances like that, we have to make sure that we keep our eye on the bigger picture of why we’re here and what it is that we need to do to get to the promised land, and those are things that the prolific achievers and champions do. They, they never lose sight of the bigger picture. They know how to manage themselves and manage other people. They know how to show up and be of service to others. They, they know how to be a trusted teammate, and when we apply those things, then we have the glue that creates harmony in the system, and when we have harmony in the system, meaning all the people that are involved in this, then we get a predicted exponential output from everybody, and that’s really the secret to this. It’s not about working harder. It’s about how do we have the fewest number of things in the system that are synergistic and compatible that when there’s harmony in the system, again leads to exponential output. So that’s the magic recipe right there.
MARK WRIGHT 25:25
Yeah. If we think about the, the outcome as opposed to the process, we’re thinking, I’ve gotta hit, hit it out of the park as a performer, 130 plus times over this tour but what you got them to think is, what I’m hearing is to, what are the things that we have to focus on that will actually lead to that outcome right?
DR. JEFF SPENCER 25:42
Yeah, it, it’s all about trusting your preparation, because if you do the preparation correctly and you have a body of evidence that informs you that you can’t do it, then you can’t do it. It’s just, again, your human mindset. When you make it too important, then you start making contingencies for everything that could go wrong, and then you become a victim of your own prophecy, and so the evidence is all in. As a matter of fact, the champion’s golden rule is, at least by my standards, what I call it, you do the homework and the test is easy. That’s how you win gold medals. You do the preparation, and we know you’re ready and there’s a body of evidence that you can do it cause you’ve already demonstrated it. Then you have to trust the preparation and not try to restrict it and control it too much when it comes time to executing what has to go right, like in real-time.
MARK WRIGHT 26:29
Speaking of that body of evidence, when I heard you explain where confidence comes from, I was really intrigued by that. You say that confidence doesn’t come from visualizing because I struggle as a golfer and I’ve done a lot of visualizing, but if I haven’t put in the practice, my shot doesn’t go where it wants to. You say that confidence comes from demonstrating what has to go right so that you have a body of evidence to trust.
DR. JEFF SPENCER 26:52
Right. That’s correct.
MARK WRIGHT 26:53
That’s such a great thing to think about.
DR. JEFF SPENCER 26:55
Yeah. Well, you, you can kind of see how the human mindset makes us, makes us think that visualization is it. I mean, but you know, practically speaking, we look at it, we know that it doesn’t, and no matter how much you think that it doesn’t, it, it’s still not, it’s a component of it for sure, but, you know, again, that’s why, uh, the prolific achievers spend more time in preparation than they do actually in performing because they know that they need to get themselves out of the way when it comes time to performing and let the performance execute the skill, and that’s a hard thing to do because you’re asking yourself to give up control, which is very hard for people to do, and that’s one of the reasons why you need my paper, you know, how not to blow it just before you win. It’s, it’s just humanly classic.
MARK WRIGHT 27:41
Yeah. Um, one thing that I love about what you stand for, Dr. Jeff, is, um, you really do, um, live a balanced life, and, and I heard you say in another interview that one of the most rewarding things that you’ve ever done in your life, if not the most rewarding thing, was to adopt your daughter. When you and your wife adopted your daughter, she was 10 years old, she was from Columbia, and I was struck by when you were talking about this, you came to the realization that you couldn’t have it all, all at once, and you came to a realization that if you wanted to be a great dad, something else had to give, and for you that was work. And that must have been a, a really pivotal moment for you.
DR. JEFF SPENCER 28:23
That’s no conflict whatsoever. You know, as I said earlier, that, you know, my deal is not chasing dreams, but it’s, um, you know, manifesting and showing up and answering the call, and that’s very easy. Like I’ve done that in most everything that I’ve done, and when we adopted our daughter, it wasn’t just Columbia, we’re talking about the crime-ridden, dirty, drug-infested, cocaine capital of the universe, where the greatest thug is the one that calls the shots. It’s so dangerous where she came from, the Columbia military won’t even go close to it. So just to sort of say that, you know, she had the most brutal, most obscene, first 10 years of your life that I would never wish on anybody, and so, when we adopted her, she didn’t speak English, we didn’t speak Spanish, we had no language. She, uh, had no school, so to speak. You can only imagine that at 10 years old she had, uh, PTSD and ADHD from getting, you know, beaten up and abused for 10 straight years. She had, uh, you know, severe, uh, parasitic, uh, infestation of the body just because of the health challenges there. She, um, had severe malnutrition for 10 years and she also had significant, trust, uh, issues. So, this is not kind of an average situation, but my wife and I didn’t just wanna save a life. We wanted to manifest the potential, and so, you know, I realized because I knew cause I’m used to producing winners and gold medalists that I need to be a gold medal father for my daughter because that was the promise that we made her, and, you know, Olympians deliver on their promise. It’s just the way it is. So, I was never conflicted about putting the career aside. A lot of people are shocked by that. They don’t understand how I could do it, but it’s really quite simple. It’s that when you’re called into action, you do, it’s required to finish the job in, in, in a gold medal way. And so, I was okay with that. Well, what about your career? Well, what about it? You know, it’s like, I’m not gonna be defined by my career. It’s really about did I show up? Did I have the courage to answer the calling? And, uh, yeah, I, I did. It came quite easily to me, as a matter of fact, and I always felt that, you know, it gives God a bigger, faster way if it be God’s desire to show me a path to a bigger future. Uh, again, and I’m not bartering for anything that’s not part of the deal. You know, it’s like, you, you can love anybody. I mean, that’s the first thing you have to understand there. There are no boundaries to that, and it is a one-way street and you don’t expect reciprocity. That’s not why you do it. You know, you do it cause you know you need to do it. And it’s the best thing that I ever did, and uh, if you ever think what you do and say and how you show up, uh, doesn’t matter, adopt a kid that hangs on every word. That you say if you wanna really see what real change is really all about. So, you know, I appreciate the kind thoughts on this, and I can honestly say that, uh, we feel like we’re the lucky ones, um, in that sense because, you know, my daughter taught me that uh, you know, uh, to be a, a perpetual winner, you have to learn how to love, and if you can’t love, then you can’t access your full potential. If you can’t acc access your full potential, you can’t leave it all on the field. And, you know, if you’re gonna honor your legacy and honor your life’s opportunities, then you, you have to again, know how to leave it all on the field. I didn’t say recklessly abandon things and do things that are silly and reckless. I said, you know, you have to be responsible, prudent, you have to recognize that there’s only so much time and energy going around and where are you gonna apply that, you know? And so, uh, best thing I ever did, and I’m really happy and proud to report that, uh, she graduated from, um, College Magna Cum Laude, you know, with honors. Yeah, it’s amazing. So, yeah. Amazing.
MARK WRIGHT 32:08
And you know, in, in that process of deciding what’s important, Dr. Jeff, I think all of us can learn from your advice of, you have to ask yourself, why am I doing this? How do I want to show up as a parent, as a spouse, as a worker, as a boss, right?
DR. JEFF SPENCER 32:22
That’s the most important question you should ask of yourself every day before you start to interface with people, like, how am I gonna show up because my daughter was severely abused and she has to bear the consequences of something that she did not ask for that was imposed upon her by people and had people shown up differently for her, the scars would be different, and that should be no different for us. You know, we have an opportunity every day based upon, you know, how we show up. Are we gonna demonstrate uh, a gratitude and a gratefulness for a pastor. This dimension, by giving everything that we’ve got to everybody that we’re in the presence of like unconditionally. I don’t, you don’t mean to say that you give everything to people that don’t appreciate it. I’m talking, you know, to those that matter that are within earshot or with an eyesight of something that we do that shows extraordinary dignity as a, as an option to the world of, uh, humanity that we live in today. Uh, are, are we really honoring the process of a pass through this dimension? I think it’s important to do that, and probably most importantly is that, uh, everything we do, uh, represents the potential for demonstrating for other people what’s possible in this dimension. And if there’s ever, in my opinion, a time in human history where we need beakers of hope, courage, and sanity. It’s like now, and it’s one thing to read about it. It’s one thing to experience it in. It’s good for us because it teaches us to not be so, uh, contingent upon things outside of ourselves for our own identity or to kind of create our own safety net for life’s challenges but it, it shows us that, you know, we can develop the individual autonomy and the capacity as an individual to hold her own in humanity,and also, uh, make our own unique contribution. Only we can make being one out of 350 billion people that have been on this planet for, since the first person put their foot on foot on this earth here.
MARK WRIGHT 34:27
Speaking of unique individual, uh, talents, um, I’d love your perspective on, on this question, how important is it to know what our natural gifts are? Because when I think about, okay, you know, we tell our kids, get out there in the world and you can do anything you want, and, but it, that, that really is predicated on you can do anything that you want, that you’re actually sort of, good at and can build on that, right? I mean, help us understand that.
DR. JEFF SPENCER 34:54
Yeah. Yeah. Well, no doubt. I mean, you know, the human mindset tells you, you can do anything that you want. Well, that’s not really true. You know, there are physical limitations, there are predispositions to ways of thinking that are just hardwired into it, that are certain, uh, parameters that can’t be transcended, and so, you know what I do know and what history says is that when we can identify our most important skills, I think that’s part of the reason why we’re here on this planet, is to be able to develop those skills and create a lifetime based on that and when we do that, we bring the best of what we got to humanity, and that to me fills its own bucket. Uh, there’s nothing more anybody could expect of us, including ourselves than to do just that. Cause that’s our greatest opportunity to, uh, live a life of tranquility of being because we know we showed up of service and honor to our potential. It, uh, also when we do our best work, um, then it allows us to know that we made our contribution to humanity in a certain sense, we kinda, uh, earned our dinner. We earned our good night’s sleep when we show up like that, and people that do that generally have a very high degree of, uh, tranquility of being, you know, where we get into trouble is where we start to measure ourself against other people’s successes, and then that kind of changes the game, but we don’t really understand the lives that people are really living behind the veil, and I’ve found that it’s generally not what you think it is, and it can’t deliver on the promise of honoring our own talents and growing and developing those and creating a life platform based on what comes naturally to us.
MARK WRIGHT 36:32
I’d like to ask you, Dr. Jeff, how important self-belief is. Um, I met, uh, Russell Wilson’s, uh, mental coach, Trevor Moawad before he passed away and had had some interactions with him that were really interesting and, and he told me one time that that Russell, one of the shortest quarterbacks in the NFL actually believed he was harder to sack because his center of gravity was lower. Ha-ha. Lower to the ground, and you know that we can debate whether that may or may not be true, but the fact was Russell had this incredible self-belief that uh, he, he and he beat all of the odds in terms of just being this little quarterback from nowhere to being one of the very, very best at what he does. So how to give us some advice on self-belief and where the appropriate sort of level should live in our minds.
DR. JEFF SPENCER 37:25
Well, the real secret to that is play your own game, because that’s what Russell did. You know, he was aware of his capacity, and every one of us has got strengths and weaknesses and when we understand that there’s always a best intersection where we can step up and claim our slice of the pie, so to speak, that our assets allow us to be able to successfully engage in and that’s why I say that it’s much more important that we always play on our side of the field and we do what we have to do to cultivate our gifts and come from our greatest strength, and when that happens, we believe in the gifts that we were given, we believe in our uniqueness which is slightly different than the question that you asked me, but I feel like that’s probably the more important, important question to ask because it provides a glimpse of what the solution is that history tells us to be true. That if you intend or desire to live a life of tranquility, of being and contribution, you don’t get any free passes, uh, because we all have to face the same stuff, you know, day in and day out but when we have that alignment, there’s a certain level of mind, body, soul connection. That kind of believes in a certain sense based on the evidence of ease with which we perform once we’ve mastered the essential skills here that, uh, when I do this, then I can live the best life possible. And we all have to reconcile that at some point in our lives.
MARK WRIGHT 38:52
I heard you say in another interview, and we’ll start to use this as a, as an opportunity to kind of start to wind things down, but I heard you say in another interview, and this is just fantastic. If you wanna live a natural life, you don’t need to do anything. Follow your whims, follow your emotions, blame other people when things go wrong, indulge in whatever you want, and see where that gets you. And I just thought that was fantastic because I think at the heart of what most of us struggle with Dr. Jeff is that if we want to be really honest, a lot of our lives we’ve just been on autopilot, right?
DR. JEFF SPENCER 39:27
Well, autopilot means that we’re letting the conversation and impulses from our human mindset, which is biology speaking, it’s our survival hard wiring to psychologically and physically survive. We’re taking our cues from that, which is living a life of extreme safety and fear and when we live in fear and safety too much, then we have to burn off our anxiety some way, which is to blame other people to whine about not being understood, you know, so on and so forth. Whatever the usual list of complaints that people like that have, victim mentality, so on and so forth, and until we recognize that there is an alternative, which is to cultivate the other side of us that’s hardwired into us, and that’s the champion mindset side of us. The champion mindset is something we can’t escape. The human mind is different because a mind is not a mindset. A mind is a living, breathing organism that has a conscious awareness. That can evaluate opportunities and circumstances and decide what to do with it. We can edit it, we can store it, we can chop it up, we can archive it, we can collate it, we can transmit it. So, you see that a mind is very different than a rope mindset. Mindset is like, well, if I say this stuff, somehow it’s gonna happen. That’s garbage. No, it’s not. You know, what’s going to, whatever you’re thinking about, whatever you decide to do is what’s gonna happen in this dimension. So I think it’s really important that we don’t mistake. Mindset, biologic hardwiring for survival with doing the actions necessary to create a life of excellence cause they’re two completely different things.
MARK WRIGHT 41:03
And to be clear, champions still feel fear, right?
DR. JEFF SPENCER 41:07
Oh, hell yeah. But here’s the deal, is that what champions know about fear is that fear is actually your friend because when you’re fearful, it could actually be like, stop, look around. You’re not ready to do this. Just take the time to look around. This is a blinking yellow light. I’m giving you a chance to see that you may not be prepared to do this, and everybody’s told you that the fear is that they need to be overcome, so you do what’s necessary to overcome the fear. Uncle Jeff says, no, you don’t do that because it may tempt you to do some things out of your own will that can go terribly wrong. I’ve seen this like, only like a million times. You wanna stop, you wanna look around, you wanna see where the danger is. You wanna see what you need to upgrade to go from red light. Don’t do it to green light. Yes, you got that all clear. Uh, fear the sign of dilated pupils, sweaty palms, increased respiration. Well, those are signs of biologic readiness to put in an extraordinary performance, and in Greg’s, uh, situation for the gold medal, you better have that because if you don’t have that, you’re not gonna jump at your best. So, Fear is our friend. In certain situations, if we interpret it correctly, it can be our worst foe when we interpret it incorrectly and we are pulled by its strings to do things prematurely, thinking that it’s the right solution and it ends up backfiring.
MARK WRIGHT 42:29
Hmm. Um, I’d like to talk just briefly about the importance of not quitting. Um, earlier in my career, I had a chance to interview Jim Whitaker, the first American to summit Mount Everest back in the sixties. This is before we had any technology to get people up to the top of that mountain. Um, and the first day that they ascended the mountain, one of their climbing partners was killed by a huge chunk of ice that was on day one and they forged ahead, and on the day that he summited the mountain, there was a terrible storm at the top and he knew he had a very short window. Um, his, his water bottle had frozen, he had frostbite that had disabled one of his eyes, it, he had his oxygen ran out, and yet he and his guide went and summited that day, and he just said, I, he said, you know, I said, what did you do? He said, I just knew that I couldn’t stop. There when you talk to some of the best athletes in the world, Dr. Jeff, what, I mean this idea of not quitting is that one of the things that really distinguishes them from the rest of us?
DR. JEFF SPENCER 43:32
Actually, it’s not the most important word that you just said in your explanation was no, because knowing is different than believing. There are people that believe that they can do it, but they’re still uncertain. I don’t know if I would, uh, take a risk on that to be true and go to the summit, but if there is something constitutionally within me and I was the observer of what my soul was perceiving, and it said, you’re ready to do this, and you knew it. You’ve all, we’ve all had that experience we, where we just knew it was what it was, and we knew it was what it was because we just knew it. We didn’t need to be further informed. So, when you feel that, then you could absolutely be absolutely 100% fearless. About proceeding forward because you’ve already be given the premonition, probably the insight, the clairvoyance, the crystal ball of that. You can actually do that, and so, it’s not an act of will. It’s an act of conscious recognition and when you know it to the deepest depths of your soul. That’s when you’re getting the all-clear sign to be able to take the action. Huge difference. Huge difference.
MARK WRIGHT 44:33
Wow. That is incredible. Okay. My perception of you, Dr. Jeff, is that your superpower and your love, uh, the thing that you love to do most in lives in your life is to transform other people’s lives. Who then, who then go on to transform other people? Um, I heard you say that you know, it, it’s on all of us to do something that lasts longer than we do. That’s something of value. What’s your best advice to everyone listening, Dr. Jeff? You know, in terms of just you know, when it comes to making a difference, when it comes to leaving our mark, um, and, and that really being our benchmark, right?
DR. JEFF SPENCER 45:13
I, I would say that the, the, without a doubt, the most important thing you could do is not to decide the value of what you’re doing and what you’re saying, because a lot of people automatically discount themselves, well, I can’t do that. Nobody’s gonna hear about this. So, they already decide in advance the value of what they’re doing and what they’re saying. They heavily discount the potential. My suggestion, give you an example is that, uh, you know, when I was a kid, nine years old, a guy came into the bike shop wearing a said USA Olympic team on it. When I saw it, I wanted the T-shirt. That became why I wanted to do it, and so, I went home, got a box of crayons, I, I drew the guy’s t-shirt and that was my logo, and I was gonna do it with my little plan. I was gonna be brave, work hard, never make an excuse, and I looked at that every day for 10 years, and he doesn’t even remember wearing the t-shirt. So, I think the important thing is that when we show up as service and we show up where we’re called to be and we give it a very fair measure of everything that we got, we don’t decide our value, we develop our skills and what we’re best at. We live a life through that. Then the influence and impact of that disseminates throughout of all of humanity for all of time. This is our unique contribution to humanity, and if you’ve lived a life like that, then you’ve lived a life well lived.
MARK WRIGHT 46:24
Hmm. So, Dr. Jeff, when all is said and done, what is it specifically that you want to be remembered for?
DR. JEFF SPENCER 46:33
Super simple. I answered the call that was fearless. When I got the call, I showed up and I delivered the goods.
MARK WRIGHT 46:45
Well, this has been, uh, just a real honor for us. Dr. Jeff. Thank you so much for your wisdom and for helping us understand so much about, uh, the champion’s mind. Um, I love it. I love it. Thank you so much for your time.
DR. JEFF SPENCER 46:59
I appreciate that. And just remember everybody, there’s always room at the top for the best. Thanks a lot, Mark.
MARK WRIGHT 47:06
I’m Mark Wright. Thanks for listening to BEATS WORKING, part of the WORK P2P family. New episodes drop every Monday, and if you’ve enjoyed the conversation, subscribe, rate, and review this podcast. Special thanks to show producer and web editor Tamar Medford. In the coming weeks, you’ll hear from our Contributors Corner and Sidekick Sessions. Join us next week for another episode of Beats Working. Where we are winning the game of work.
