Lessons From the Farm with John Warkentin

This week, we’re bringing you lessons from the farm—but they’re about so much more than farming. If you’ve wondered how to help your kids find meaningful work, get ready for inspiration from a wheat farmer-entrepreneur from Saskatchewan, Canada.

John Warkentin is a 4th-generation grain farmer. After getting a degree in finance, he and his wife returned to the farm to start their life together. Over the next couple of decades, they got really good at the business of farming.

But as entrepreneurs at heart, they wanted more. So, as John grew a commercial property appraisal business, they also started building and developing multi-family housing. In this episode, he reveals the unique strategy that helped keep his properties full even during the pandemic.

John is also part of Strategic Coach, a company dedicated to growing entrepreneurs. He used the Coach concept that worked so well for him to help his sons find their own place in the world of work.

“John taught his boys that work is not just trading time for money,” says BEATS WORKING host Mark Wright. “It’s about using your unique ability to do meaningful work that energizes us and creates value at the same time.”

Resources from the episode:

Learn more about Warkentin Residential ⁠here⁠.
Learn more about Strategic Coach, the #1 business coaching program for entrepreneurs, ⁠here⁠.
Looking for another podcast for business owners looking for new ways of thinking? Discover the latest Strategic Coach podcasts ⁠here⁠.

⁠

Share Article on Social Media

Transcript

The following transcript is not certified. Although the transcription is largely accurate, in some cases it is incomplete or inaccurate due to inaudible passages or transcription errors. The information contained within this document is for general information purposes only.

Speakers: John Warkentin and Mark Wright

JOHN WARKENTIN 00:00

So, we get halfway home, and this one actually kind of choked me up to be totally honest. He stops, he stops conversation. He’s like, dad, I get it. I get it. He said, uh, I figured out what you meant about energy. He’s like, I absolutely hated myself when I got out of that first part of the day, which was his lifeguard. He’s like, you know, I’m pumped. And he’s like, I will never take another job just for the money again. And I mean, he was 17.

MARK WRIGHT 00:36

This is the BEATS WORKING show. We’re on a mission to redeem work – the word, the place, and the way. I’m your host, Mark Wright. Join us at winning the game of work. Welcome to BEATS WORKING. On the show this week, lessons from the farm. But it’s about so much more than farming. John Warkentin is a fourth-generation grain farmer in Saskatchewan, Canada. After getting a degree in finance, he and his wife went back to the farm to start their life together. And over the next couple of decades, they got really good at the business of farming. But as entrepreneurs at heart, they wanted more. As John grew a commercial property appraisal business, they also started building and developing multifamily housing. John revealed to me a unique strategy that helped keep their properties full, at capacity, even during the pandemic. John is also part of Strategic Coach, a company dedicated to growing entrepreneurs. And he decided to use a coach concept to help his sons find their place in the world of work. John taught his boys that work is not just trading time for money, it’s about using your unique ability to do meaningful work that energizes you and creates value at the same time. It’s a lot of wisdom from the Canadian heartland. I hope you find inspiration and enjoy my conversation with John Warkentin. John Warkentin, welcome to the BEATS WORKING podcast. I’ve been looking forward to seeing you. Welcome.

JOHN WARKENTIN 02:08

Yeah, and thanks for the invite.

MARK WRIGHT 02:10

So, John, I’ve been looking forward to this because I think you’re the very first farmer that we’ve had on the BEATS WORKING podcast. I grew up on a farm here in the States. You’re in kind of the south middle of Canada, up in Saskatchewan. Um, but you’re not just a farmer. Um, you’re also in real estate, um, you’ve done a praising, um, you’ve got, uh, all kinds of irons in the fire that we’re going to explore. So, this is going to be fun, John. Um, I would love your perspective, John, on what it’s like to grow up on a farm and the value that, that you got in your life from, from growing up on a farm.

JOHN WARKENTIN 02:48

Yeah, I think it’s a very different way to grow up. So, I grew up on a, on a grain farm. So, at the time, we grew wheat and derm and barley, so normal cereal crops. Um, I’m in, just outside of a small city called Swift Current, which is 100 miles north of Montana. So, for you people from the States, it gives you a little perspective. Just on the Canadian side. I think the biggest thing is how I grew up perceiving work versus my friends that grew up in the city. I think the easiest way to describe it would be more like a to do list than an occupation. So, there’s things that need to be done. Um, you get up in the morning and you get stuff done that needs to get done. It was as simple as that. We didn’t think about it in terms of work. We thought about it in terms of um, I’m not going to say it was a lifestyle. It was just, it was given that when things had to get done, we went out and we did them. And that was the nature of how that, that did. And it didn’t matter whether it was yard work or field work. Um, but I think it gave me a completely different perspective on, on how I viewed work versus my friends that would have grown up in the city. Um, I know I had this, uh, several years ago when I was older and obviously we’re entrepreneurs, but, um, we took care of my sister in law’s kids because they were on a hot holiday and my niece would have been in school, I don’t know if she was six or seven, but I was tasked with giving her a ride to school and her first question was, well, you know, what time do you have to be at work? And for me, that’s a very odd question. For me, I don’t think about it in terms of what time I have to be at work. She grew up in a very structured home where her parents worked eight hours a day. And she couldn’t understand why for me, it didn’t make any difference if I dropped her off at quarter to 8 or 8:30. Um, but it gave me a perspective how different m y life is. Nobody cares when you’re a farmer or whether you’re a business owner, what time you get to work. They only care when stuff gets done and what gets done. So, it’s a, but it was one, it was like one of those things where you’re, you know, you’re normal morning routine and you’re having your cup of coffee and all of a sudden you get a question that seems to be so out of the blue, but from her perspective, I totally understood it.

MARK WRIGHT 05:26

Uh, yeah.

JOHN WARKENTIN 05:27

So again, I mean, it sort of relates to what you asked, but it. I think it really, that’s what it is. It’s about, it’s about getting stuff done, not, you know, trading time for mine.

MARK WRIGHT 05:37

Yeah. Yeah. I think that’s the common perception for a lot of people is just, you know, I’m going to show up at this place in time. I’m going to spend X number of hours doing something, and then I’m going to, you know, not literally punch the time clock, but then at some point go home and then I’m off, off work. Um, John, tell me more about the resourcefulness, all the farmers that I know um, it’s a really great lifestyle because it forces you to figure stuff out. Like if something breaks, you, you’ve got to fix it. And, uh, if something goes wrong, you’ve got to deal with it. Um, talk about that aspect of farming.

JOHN WARKENTIN 06:18

Yeah, I think that’s a hundred percent and it’s one of the reasons why we actually decided to keep farming instead of going a different direction. It’s because we have two boys, and the life lessons it taught them. It’s easier for me to see it in their perspective rather than when I was a kid, maybe. But, um, you know, especially the more intense parts of the farming season. So, seeding, harvest, spraying, rarely do you go through a day where everything works the way it’s supposed to. Um, and I think one of the lessons that teaches because it’s so repetitive is when something goes wrong, you stop, you figure out what went wrong, you figure out what you need to do to get it fixed or fix it yourself. And then you proceed with the next step. Um, when I look at, you know, I would say typical people that don’t have that as part of their life. When something blows up or breaks, it’s devastating to them. Whereas when it is something that you’re used to, um, you know, I think your, your instant reaction in, in times of trouble um, are much different. I think it’s a learned behavior. But as far as resourcefulness, I mean, the other thing it teaches you is really about using what you have in front of you to get the job done. Um, and, and that isn’t, I’m not sure, a normal way of looking at it. I think most people when things go wrong. They want to go, you know, they want to outsource that fix. They want to phone a mechanic if their vehicle breaks. They want to go to their boss if they have a problem. Um, but it’s like being an entrepreneur maybe on steroids because most entrepreneurs I know have people in place to do things. But when it comes to agriculture, um, you know, the ability to be a mechanic and to figure out the commodity markets and to, you know, the, you figure out the systems and processes to make you efficient, to reduce your equipment costs, to be able to track all your inputs and to make sure that you’re fixed and, uh, you know, variable costs all make sense, you can make money. The number of things that you have to be able to do is a producer to be profitable. Um, you know, besides trying to control the weather, quote unquote, you know, it, it, it’s, uh, it forces you to learn a lot of aspects that wouldn’t be normal in a lot of businesses, much less. You know, eight to five jobs, if you want to call them that.

MARK WRIGHT 08:57

Yeah, and you, you touched on control, and I think, I think that’s the beauty also of farming is that, you know, we have this illusion that we somehow control our lives. But in farming, you absolutely realize that most of what happens to those crops is completely outside your control. And you just have to deal with, with, with the reality of, of weather, right? And the patterns and the timing.

JOHN WARKENTIN 09:21

Yeah, and I think, um, the best way I can explain it is you control what you can, what you can control. So, farmers don’t sit around and talk about it in these terms, but we all have risk mitigating strategies. Um, Canada’s got crop insurance and what’s called Agri Stability, which are kind of quasi government programs that help us stabilize our income and, you know, droughts or commodity price wrecks. I’m not sure where the U. S. programs fit. But there are um, we basically farm against the averages, uh, very early on in my farming, uh, call it career, a very elderly producer told me, he’s like, okay, if you got 10 years, you’re going to grow a crop in two years, you’re going to hit a home run. It’s going to be awesome. He said, you know, five or six years are going to be average mediocre, and two or three years are going to be a wreck. Um, so if you’re going into this thinking that you’re going to be hitting home runs every year, um, Mother Nature will teach you some nasty lessons. And I think that’s the other thing. You know, I think a lot of people have a, a sense of control that isn’t really founded in reality. Um, so, you know, I know a lot of people with pretty stable jobs and they think they’re going to do that until they’re 65 and they’re going to have their pension and, you know, now that I’m in my 50s and I have friends and, you know, in these scenarios, I watch them and when their world gets blown up because the company you get, they work for has a problem or they get laid off or something happens, um, it’s almost like they were certain that this was going to happen for, you know, until they retired. And I think it’s a different perspective when you know, you know, we’re in the middle of, we’re three years into a drought where we farm, um, where we’ve grown less than 50 percent of our long-term averages and crops three years in a row. And, you know, we’re going into the spring knowing that you know, there is, there’s no guarantee this drought’s going to break. Yes, El Nino turned El Nino. We should see some difference in the, you know, in the weather patterns for 2024, but it’s a reality that we face every day. Um, whereas I think a lot of people almost create a delusional belief that they’re in a secure environment or their normal is going to continue. And yes, that’s more stable in weather patterns. But it’s not as stable as I think people believe it is.

MARK WRIGHT 12:10

Yeah. So, you’re a farm kid. You go to university, correct me if I’m wrong, but you got a degree in, in finance, right?

JOHN WARKENTIN 12:18

Yeah. So, um, business has always interested me. Um, there’s probably a whole bunch of reasons for it, but the other thing was when it came to the school system, I had really good marks in certain subjects and really bad marks and others. I’m dyslexic. So, the whole, you know, reading, writing reports, that stuff never really fit with me. Um, I was fortunate that the dyslexia didn’t mess up my math. Um, so I gravitated towards math, ended up in finance. Um, and that really worked well. And I was interested in how money worked. Um, I got out of university in 93, can’t remember what it was like in the U.S. side, but in Canada, in Western Canada, um, you know, late 80s, early 90s was, not a very good economy to get out of school, you know, most of the people I’d complicated with would have been unemployed. Um, I ended up moving back my fiancée at the time, my wife, Kim, um, had a job at Ag Canada, which is kind of like our government research, agricultural research, which happened to be in Swift Current. Um, so we moved back, got married and, you know, um, to be honest, I, I’ve been an entrepreneur. I haven’t had a job, so to speak, since um, I convocated. So, we ended up, uh, back, she grew up on a farm. I grew up on a farm. They were both 20 miles apart. Uh, so we started out with helping parents’ farm, um, with my finance degree and everything that was going on in agriculture, then, um, federal government kind of has a farm banking company called Farm Credit Corporation. And they repossessed an awful lot of land in the late eighties when things were tough, and they were in the process of selling it back to farmers. Um, because I’d worked for Ag Credit, which is like our provincial version of that, as a summer student when I was in university, I essentially got hired under contract to do farm valuations to help them come up with a fair price to sell some of this land back to the farmers that lost it. And that turned into me being, uh, you know, a commercial appraiser for the last 30 years. Um, so we have the two businesses. Kept up with the farm, um, and that turned from us helping parents to taking over farms to buying out neighbors. Um, once our second son was born, my wife quit her federal government job, which is like, you know, going away from the whole eight to five thing and pensions and benefits and we were all in. It was, um, you know. We’re going to be farmers and keep the other business. We’re going to make it work. That followed three years of drought. So, my wife quits her federal government job, and we end up in three wrecks in a row at the farm. Um, we made it through, uh, you know, a really difficult period. Two babies in diapers, so to speak, and no, no steady paycheck. Um, then when we came out the other end of that, um, you know, we ended up with about, from 04 to about 2016 was really good. Uh, what happened in that downturn was we got really good at farming. Uh, my wife is an agronomist, worked in research. We figured out how to grow bigger crops. We figured out how to, you know, implement a bunch of new technology in the farm. Um, when we came home after university, farming was tough. So, all my dad’s equipment and all Kim’s dad’s equipment was wore out. But we went through this period where we invested heavily in new equipment and new technology. We brought our farm up. You know, from cold old school farming to it’s technically advanced as it was at that time. Um, and we really built our margins because we were efficient. We were good at what we did. And then we went through this 10- or 12-year period where, um, we kind of capitalized on those margins we created, and we make pretty good money. Since 2016 we’ve been in a drought cycle. We kind of had to go back to the drawing board, but, um, yeah, we ended up with a two and you know, I think in hindsight, we made, made out really well as far as building wealth for ourselves. But, um, you know, the problem with farming is it’s really capital intensive. So, you keep pouring the money back in. And now we’ve got 20 something year olds for kids. And, um, you know, you don’t want to get back to where we were when we started. So, it’s been, yeah, it’s been an interesting ride.

MARK WRIGHT 17:11

When we talked a while back, John, you talked about the lessons that you’ve been helping your two sons learn when it comes to work. And you say that there was a time when you were driving your son home, I think, from his lifeguard job, and, and, and it was a real epiphany for your son. Um, and, and the lesson that you taught him was to pay attention to the work that gives you energy. Um, if you could tell that story again, I think that’s, I think that’s just a, a really illuminating story that, that we can all, you know, kind of teach our kids.

JOHN WARKENTIN 17:46

Yeah. And so I, I think he had Julia Waller on a while back. Is that correct? Yeah.

MARK WRIGHT 17:50

Yeah. That’s Strategic Coach.

JOHN WARKENTIN 17:52

So, Julia is my call it unique ability coach. Uh, she’s also a friend. Um, but by this point in time, I joined Strategic Coach, um, for a number of reasons, but it really kind of latched onto her concept of unique ability, um, made a lot of sense to me, um, and I tried teaching it to my kids. Now they were in high school at this point. Well you want to talk about unique ability to high school kids, they think you’re crazy. Like it’s a language around the way Julia talks and how she teaches. It works totally good if you’re a 50 year old business guy, but it’s not so good when you’re trying to communicate to teenagers. So, I was looking for ways that I could call it hack Julia’s training in a way that it made sense to my kids. So, one of the things I really learned when I worked with her was to watch your energy and we’ve all had that experience where, you know, some days when you go home from work, you were absolutely beat, drained, you still work the same number of hours, but you don’t do anything other than have something to eat, sit on the couch and go to bed. And, you know, in, in working through some of the Strategic Coach concepts that one being the ability, it was like, okay, like, why are some 8-hour days or 10-hour days or 12-hour days energizing? And why aren’t some, and I mean, there’s a whole, she explained it far better than I ever will, but I was trying to communicate this to our kids. So, at the time, my high school kid was a lifeguard because he figured out that if you were a lifeguard in our city, you’re getting paid about 50 percent more than people that are working at a fast-food restaurant or pumping gas. So, he took the extra few courses he needed. He got the job, paid the best he could in high school. He thought he was doing everything right. Logically, that makes sense. The problem was it didn’t make him happy. He didn’t enjoy it. So, we were combined at the farm and, uh, it was really interesting because he had to work a 6-hour shift. He got the early shift. So I stayed at the office and I thought I’d just wait and pick him up after his shift and we’d go out and take the later shift on the combine and I picked him up and yeah, he was, he was grumpy and yawning, fed him some food, took him to the farm, but I thought, oh God, he’s going to be done today. We get there, worked 6 more hours. So now we’re at 12 or probably 13. Cause we drove. He gets back in my truck, and he was pumped, like absolutely chattering, couldn’t shut him up, just having the best evening. And I’m like, wow, you know, the last time I got into a pickup with this guy, he was like totally drained. So, we get halfway home. And this one actually kind of chokes me up to be totally honest, but he stops, he stops conversation. He’s like, dad, I get it. I get it. He said, uh, I figured out what you meant about energy. He’s like, I absolutely hated myself when I got out of that first part of the day, which was his lifeguard. And he’s like, you know, I’m pumped. And he’s like, I will never take another job just for the money again in my life. And I mean, he was 17. So fast forward to today, got his degree in agriculture. Um, because of COVID, we lost our hired help at the farm. So, kids came home. You know, we actually turned the farm back into a family farm, which you know, really hadn’t been run with just family for a decade at least. Um, and now he’s working full time and his other passion is customizing trucks. He’s got a little small business that he works on, on his stuff and other people’s stuff as well. But, you know, it was, he, he, he made that connection where it isn’t, those decisions can’t just be about the money. And I think for anybody who’s listening, like, you know, this whole concept of us trading our time for money. Weaves out exactly what that story tells. It’s like if you go to work and it’s the highest paying job you can get, which is how we normally teach people how to get a job. And you leave work every day and you’re drained. Yes, you might have a few more dollars to go buy material items in the future. But if you look at what that does to your life versus coming home from work in a good mood with energy and what that means to the people you care about, when you get home, what you get done in the evenings. Um, you know, I look at my son, he works full time at the farm, and he’s got enough energy to work on his, his small business that he started on top of that. Um, if he was drained when he got home, that wouldn’t be part of his life, you know, and you know, I think we’re all guilty of taking no bad days on people we care about. Um, at least I am. And I think if you can get your, if you can really watch those you know, those situations where, yeah, you might get an extra, whatever it is, few bucks an hour working for somebody, but if it’s taken away from, um, you know, how you feel at the end of the day or how much energy is pulling from you during the day, um, it’s, it’s a factor that I think a lot of people don’t take into consideration.

MARK WRIGHT 23:35

Wow. That’s such a great story, John. And the fact that as a 17-year-old, your son was able to have that light bulb come on. And I think just the fact that you got him to start thinking about that as a teenager, I think is such a valuable lesson, because I think a lot of us, myself included, went really deep into college in an area that was not suited for me. And I wasted a ton of time and money and energy before I failed and failed. And then, oh, I’m going, then I got on the right track, but, but teaching our kids, uh, that is such an important, um, life lesson. Um, your other son, uh, love to drive trucks, right? And now is, uh, is a tool distributor, right? Tell, tell me about your other son.

JOHN WARKENTIN 24:19

Yeah. My other guy, uh, you know, I think this gets back to, um, kind of that summer of 2020 and, uh, you know, the whole COVID crisis, but, um, he’s always got to be on the go. Uh, so our younger son, you know, to this day, if he’s got nothing to do for 15 minutes, he gets up, leaves and goes and does something else. You just can’t. He just can’t be, um, inactive. And so, he went to Calgary after high school, take a welding program, likes to be busy and likes to work with his hands that got shut down mid program because of COVID. Um, like I said, he, both kids ended up home. We went from no kids in the house to two kids, plus a girlfriend in our bubble, when COVID hit.

MARK WRIGHT 25:08

Full house.

JOHN WARKENTIN 25:09

Full house. And, uh, we never had girls. So, it was the first time we had girls living with us. That was another whole interesting, yeah. Yeah, uh, interesting life lesson. But, um, yeah, and at the same time, we had a couple staff members that left. Uh, for a couple different reasons, but, uh, basically it was, okay, well, you know, kind of back to that whole farm lesson, it’s like, what, who do we got to do the work this year and how are we going to do? Um, so it was really interesting cause I had a, you know, I got a, at the time, a 19-year-old and a 21-year-old and you know how brothers are, they’re always competing or at least ours, ours were, um, and we’re going to work together as a family unit, have to get this done. This whole farming season done with that and seeding started out, I’m not going to say rough, there was this tension and competition and, you know, um, the two brothers wanting to do things the same, you know, their way and do the same jobs. And again, getting back to Julia’s unique ability, um, I had to communicate what she teaches in a way that two competitive 20 something year olds could understand. Um, so we just started talking about who’s better for what job. So, if I need to get a ridiculous amount of work done in a short period of time, and it only needs to be done to 90%, not perfect. My guy, that’s the Energizer, Buzzy, Buddy, the younger guy is the absolute, he will outwork everybody I know. He just puts his head down and gets it done. It’s not perfect, but if you need to get volume done, uh, he’s the guy, his brother, like I said, he, he builds trucks. He’s very detail oriented, uh, or more so. Um, you know, if something breaks on the farm, he’s the go to. He’ll ask if he needs help, but give him space. So, we changed this whole attitude around, you know, dad’s the boss. Dad tells us what to do. And we’re employees to who in the operation is best to do that task. And it took about a month or two of working together as a unit before they got it. But once they got it, because kids pick this stuff up way better than old people like us. Um, but once they got it, it was, hey, you know what? I’m gonna let my brother have this one because this is in his wheelhouse. Um, and, and by the time we hit harvest, I mean, the amount of work we were getting done with a smaller crew. And how these guys were working together and, you know, again, um, to this day, they went from really scrapping a lot before that to after that summer, they’re like best friends, like, honestly, they spent a ton of time together, but the whole competition thing worked out. They realized they both have their quirks. They’re both good at certain things and not at others. And the beautiful thing about unique ability is when you learn what you’re good at, you also recognize what other people are good at. So, when I first started working with Julia, I really thought it was kind of a selfish thing. It’s like, I’m working on myself. I’m trying to figure out what I’m good at, but the opposite actually is true. It’s like when you start to look at your strengths and you’re honest about your weaknesses or shortcomings, the people that fill those gaps on you. You value so much more than you would have before you start looking at it and to see it come together with 20 something, it was, uh, yeah, it was, it was remarkable. I mean, COVID hurt, hurt our family. We lost some people. It was, I mean, it was far from you know how you draw it up, but that summer was pretty special for, for our crew. Um, but you know, so what happened then was it didn’t work for Kurt to go back to the welding industry because that all got disrupted. Um, he decided to drive semi-truck for a few months because when you farm, getting your, your semi license is an important thing. We call it a One A in Canada. Um, so after harvest, he wouldn’t go to his One A, drove truck for a while. That wasn’t going to work out. And then one day he came to me and he’s like, hey I want to check out this Snap on tool franchise. So, in our city, Snap on dealer kind of closed up a few years before that market hadn’t been supplied. And I’m like, okay, I mean, we’ve always started businesses from scratch. We’ve never looked at a franchise, but I mean, we, we know, we know all this stuff works. So, let’s look at it. So, he got ahold of Snap on. Snap on sent like a 500-page document of disclosures, right? This is my kid who can’t sit still. So, he shows up at my house one weekend with this brick of paper. And I’m like, oh no, this is like, remember I’m dyslexic, right? So, for reading,

MARK WRIGHT 30:16

500 pages of fine print.

JOHN WARKENTIN 30:19

Some lawyer wrote, right? It’s just like, you gotta be kidding me. But I’m like, we got to do this, right? If you’re going to seriously look at this, is it a good opportunity, isn’t it? You know, and I got a degree in business, you know, we’ve, we’ve run businesses for 30 years, like we can figure this out. Um, so we did, we, I took the weekend, you know, throughout most of the legal jargon, but kind of worked through, we built a business, um, kind of a business plan to kind of see what he could make, what he couldn’t make. Um, and then the most important part. So, if you would have, you know, if it had been 15 years earlier, this would have been a math problem for me. I’m a math guy. It would have been, how much can he, on average, make if he’s an average snap on guy in camp? And we work it out. All the, you know, all the ratios are there. We can do it. But the important piece that we learned, or I learned through a Strategic Coach was, does this fit his abilities? Um, so we Googled what’s great about those franchises and what isn’t good. What do people complain about? Um, and one of the things that kept coming up in these searches was, if you’re going to be a single person, uh, dealer and not hire help, you might have to work 50, 60 hours a week. And the other thing was you’re always on the road, you’re always moving. So, when we overlaid the problems with his strengths. It’s like, this is his, you know, he’s been getting up at five in the morning. I think since he was three, like, this is, I mean, Robin Sharma is 5 A.M. Club. I mean, this kid was like the first member. It was, he’s been up. It’s just the nature of how he’s wired. Um, so yeah, he started, you know, and, and, uh, high school wasn’t his thing for a lot of reasons, but, you know, we put them in a, in a scenario, we worked through this and he ended up, he paid off his, his big diesel truck that he had was driving at the time, and he sold the truck to pay for the franchise fees. We obviously, uh, you know, when you’re 20, you can’t get loans for inventory. So, mom and dad, you know, as parents, we backed him a little bit, but it wasn’t, you know, he’s basically got us paid back now after three years. Um, but yeah, I mean, so what we did was instead of looking at this business opportunity as a financial, purely financial perspective, we really wanted to make sure it fit with him. So, he’s a super outgoing people person. He reads people very quickly and very well. He always wants to be on the go. He likes to work like 40 hours a week would be short for him. Um, and it kind of worked. Well, we put them in this, we ended up helping him get started. And in the first year, I believe he was within the top 10 or 15 percent of franchises in Canada and now first year at 20, um, you know, didn’t really have business experience, but I think growing up in an entrepreneurial home, like it’s not the same as starting from scratch, like I think, plus, you know, between my wife, Kim and I, you don’t know what you know until you’re asked, um, but a lot of our knowledge and experience and who we connect with and how we handle accounting, lawyers and all this stuff, it’s pretty routine for us at this point. Um, and that was a pretty good fit. You could, you could kind of lean on us that way, but yeah, you know, and now he’s maybe three years in, in next month and, you know, he’s, he’s got his, uh, he’s essentially got his, his, um, you know, startup inventory, all that stuff paid for, um, you know, and he’s functioning on his own and, you know, take, take a kid who really didn’t fit the school system very well, but matching his abilities to that business and, um, and then letting them roll and watching him, you know, go from knocking. I wouldn’t say he wasn’t a confident person, but the amount of confidence he got by having that success that young, um, was, you know, as parents, I mean, those are the wins that, you know, I can make money. That’s all good. We can build wealth. But when you, when I see, you know, the concepts that I’ve taken from the coaching programs and the learning that I’ve done, and when you, when you watch it work in, in your kids. Um, I mean, those are wins that, you know, you can’t really qualify with money.

MARK WRIGHT 35:00

So, you’ve got farming, you’ve had a commercial appraising business for decades, and, and then you got into commercial, uh, or I should say real estate development as well. John, tell, tell me how you got into that and, and what the biggest lessons that you learned because you build multifamily housing now, right?

JOHN WARKENTIN 35:18

Yeah, so I mean, the, the concept was really, um, so we, we’d had some success obviously in the farm side, uh, we built some wealth. And so, it was 2008, uh, stock market just crashed. Uh, we were sitting in a really pretty solid financial position. So, we weren’t over leveraged, you know, we weren’t in the thing about ag and real estate is it’s pretty stable, even in a downturn, you know, our businesses really didn’t see much fluctuation. Um, so it gave us a position to do something. Our kids at the time would have been seven and nine, and we didn’t know if they were going to be involved in the farm. There was only so much work we wanted to take on with a hired man. And at the time we were farming about 4,000 acres and, you know, in normal businesses, you keep growing to build your wealth and expand. My thought was rather than buy more farmland, why don’t we leverage our farmland and buy income real estate on commercial income, you know, our income property appraiser. I’ve watched clients build wealth. I had a different perspective because I was kind of you know, an expert in the property valuation side. So, in 2010, we essentially built our first eight plex multifamily. Um, and got into the income property side, um, that proceeded to now we’ve got, you know, 50 units and some commercial buildings. Um, but really we went from building low cost multifamily to building more energy efficient, more sustainable. We’ve kind of gone through this progression and, you know, it’s kind of the direction we’re working on now. Um, but really it was a way originally to leverage our equity in the farm. And still continue to grow wealth, uh, and to make better use of some of the people we had in our appraisal company. Um, you know, when I look, you know, it’s funny because I mean, being in the valuation industry, I thought I knew more than I did, which is very often when you get into a new venture, right? I didn’t know what I didn’t know. Um, and so I kind of had the idea that this was like I’m on a mutual fund cause I kinda know people look at real estate. Um, it’s a lot more like owning a business, uh, I think is the biggest takeaway that I’ve had um, construction’s a whole different thing, you know, cause we, we go from, you know, buying development land to building them and then we keep them, uh, get them financed out. And then we also do the property management or deal with tenants. So, um, you know, we kind of take that full spectrum, um, but it’s been, uh, you know, I really think multifamily is very much more like a business because, I mean, who’s your end customer? It’s the tenant. So, your product is the whatever there happened to rent. Um, you know, we got into, uh, newer buildings for the simple reason, like I credit my wife here. Um, her first thought was, we’re going to buy existing. So, we were going to buy, you know, maybe apartment buildings built in the eighties. And she’s like, well, if we take 25 years to pay off a building that’s already 30 years old, we’re going to have 50- or 60-year-old buildings by the time they’re paid for. She didn’t think that made any sense. When we got into new, um, you know, construction that way, when they do get paid for their 20 or 25 years old and their longevity. But the piece that came as a bit of a surprise to me, it’s an interesting, uh, business in that the type of income property you own in a large, to a large extent depicts your customer. So if the customer is the tenant, um, and you want to have the top 10 percent of tenants in your community. Your property has to be suitable for that. And if you want, call it slumlord type buildings, they make money too. But now you’re dealing with the tenants that occupy that space. So, what happened was, we ended up with the newest properties in the city, uh, or income properties in the city, and we also took pride in them, because we owned them and it’s our retirement fund. It’s, you know, when you’re an entrepreneur, you have no pension, you know, you either you pay off something or you save it. In our case, I’m better at paying stuff off than I am at putting money into the stock market. So, this is really so, but when it’s your pension fund and you control it, you treat it differently than some person who owns a building that looks at it simply as an investment. Um, so between having new, taking good care of them and treating tenants as you know, customers, because we’re entrepreneurs, that’s how we looked at them. Uh, we ended up, you know, largely full. Um, you know, we’ve been successful at, at keeping them full and making returns. Um, but it, it really has been a way that we could leverage what we knew from before, learn more about the industry we got into, and, you know, continue to create wealth growth that, uh, is largely in equity. You know, COVID was a bit of a, COVID was actually there too. I mean, so I had a staff member that took care of tenants directly. So, we property managed our own buildings, but I didn’t do it personally. And I thought I knew how our tenants were being taken care of. And I thought I knew more about the industry than I did. So COVID hits that lady, uh, moved, moved on, doesn’t work for me anymore. And we had tenants that got laid off or were, you know, couldn’t go to work because of COVID. And I’m like, well, my appraisal business almost came to a standstill. I’m like, maybe this is my job for now. Do we kind of, while I got time and we figured out, um, until I dealt directly with tenants, I didn’t really understand all their problems and what they were dealing with and how they, you know, what was important to them. Um, you know, how they viewed our properties and how they viewed us. Uh, so it was really, it was a really an eye opener when I was actually the guy, you know, handing over the keys and showing units and showing up when the door didn’t open. It was frozen or it was broken or, um, so it gave me, you know, that was really an interesting time period because I think it was, it’s almost like the whole thing came full circle. I mean, I knew how the development side worked. I knew all the financing side and the returns were, um, but it really made, it’s so clear to me that this is a business and it, you know, those people that occupy your space and pay your rent aren’t just tenants. It’s not just something that’s expected and it’s part. You have to supply a service and a product to those people if you’re going to have longevity. Um, and I think that’s a different perspective than I get from, um, my customers that just own income. They think they can hire a property manager, the property manager is going to keep it full, they’re going to get a return, and it’s very much more transactional than when you actually get down to the nuts and bolts of how that runs. So, you know, I really think, uh, again, it’s just, it’s a, it’s a different way of looking at it, but it was really an eye opener for me. I mean, we literally research all the government grant programs and all the things that they could do to get money to pay rent and, and help them fill out forms and, um, you know, it was not my normal, but it, uh, yeah, it was interesting how that whole year went.

MARK WRIGHT 43:31

And it, and it showed them that you cared, right?

JOHN WARKENTIN 43:34

Yeah. I did have to make, like anybody who’s in business has people problems, whether they’re your people or they’re your customer or they’re yourself. I think honestly, we all have challenges we got to work through, but, um, you know, I had a, I got a single mother that’s been in, in our buildings for about five years and it’s her home, right? It’s not just her house. Somewhere she rents, she went through a separation or divorce or something and she needed somewhere nice and safe to raise her kids. And, um, she didn’t have money for rent. And she phoned me, and it was like, she didn’t want to move out, she didn’t know what to do. And, you know, there were cases like that where, you know, we made deals where, hey, we’re not going to charge you rent for a month or two or like, can you pay me a third? Or can you, I still got to make my payments. So, like, like I need some money. But like, what can you do? Um, we went 20 percent vacant, um, at the start of COVID because some of our people that were renting from us weren’t from the city. They were, you know, you talk about, uh, WHL teams. Swift Green has a, has a WHL team, the Broncos. Well, one of their trainers rented from us. Well, what’s the first thing the club did? He sent him home, right? So, you know, his unit was open. Um, but what I found was, because we were proactive, and you’re right, we did show them we care. Um, I mean, some of it was selfish. I wanted my building full. Um, the other thing we did, we went to everybody and said, hey, um, you’re our best advertisers. Um, we are going to give you, we’re going to voluntarily give you a rent reduction. So, what did that actually work out to? Yeah, it was only 5%. But we voluntarily rewrote everybody’s leases that stayed and dropped their rents by 5%. And we said, if this helps us fill the buildings, I’m going to make more money, I’m going to reward you for staying. But in three months we were full. Like it was unbelievable how just engaging with the tenants, offering them a reward for staying, telling them we appreciated them, um, it turned that, because it was stressful. I mean, when you first, the project I’m talking about, we’ve literally just finished it, like it’s we built it over 2018, 2019, brand new, fully leveraged. So, like we had max mortgages on this thing, and we went 20 percent vacant. I’m like, you can’t really draw it up much worse from an income property standpoint. And, uh, but we got, you know, like I said, I mean, we took it over, we got involved and, uh, within three months we were full. Um, you know, the income came back around, and year ended up turning out not bad. We were able to leave those rent reductions in place for the people that stayed until this last interest rate increase over, you know, the last 18 months, I couldn’t keep passing along that discount because our costs went up. Um, the feedback I got that it was such a different result than what they expected from all one. But it you know, it, it was a case where because we are entrepreneurs, because we looked at it as a business, not an investment, we were able to, uh, yeah, take what we know, um, extrapolated to a new business or new concept. And, you know, to this day, it’s been a positive thing for that business.

MARK WRIGHT 47:12

So, John, before we wrap things up, I wanted to ask you, you mentioned you have dyslexia and a friend of the podcast, André Brisson, host of the Impulsive Thinker podcast. Is it true that André encouraged you to get tested for ADHD? Um that’s question one. And then what was the result of that? Because I think it’s really interesting to me that so many entrepreneurs have ADHD, how did all that unfold?

JOHN WARKENTIN 47:41

Yeah. So, André is now a close friend. Uh, you know, full disclosure, uh, it was one of his original three in his first group. Uh, he started tactical breakthroughs, which is his ADHD Entrepreneur Coaching Program. Uh, I mean, we could talk for another hour on that. It’s been, you know, we just wrapped it up. Uh, it was remarkable. But, um, through COVID, Strategic Coach went to Zoom. Um, and I met André in a Zoom breakout session. And I can’t remember what we were talking about, but I made a quip about, oh, that must be ADHD. Not really realizing that it was. And, uh, he’s like, uh, you mind if I give you a call or can we talk about this? Um, so yeah, you know, that conversation went on for about a year. We got back to in person and he’s like, you know, I think you might want to get, you might want to get tested. Um, so about a year ago at 52, you know, I got diagnosed with hyperactive inattentive ADHD. Um, and we got our kids tested as well. And I mean, you know, normal is what you get used to, but that, you know, they’re dealing with some of the same things I am. Um, and it’s funny because, and our host thought it was normal, right? Like everybody’s got their own normal. But in our host, uh, these challenges, if you want to call them that, are, uh, were just something that we accepted and it was normal and, you know, there wasn’t a lot of judgment around it. Um, but André was instrumental in, in me going through trying to figure that out and also, you know, in helping me. André’s a crazy researcher kind of guy. Um, and so thank you. His level of research and being able to bring that back, simplify it, and communicate it to me is, has been, uh, deeply helpful. Um, and the, you know, the stuff I’ve learned that I’ve been able to, again, translate and communicate to, you know, my kids that are in their 20s. I’m like, on one hand, you’re like, God, I wish I would have known that 30 years ago, but it is, you know, a lot of the things um, that were challenging over the years are explained. And the other interesting thing that I thought about, cause you know, now we’re wrapping up his first tactical, he wanted feedback. And I said, you know, I always knew like as far back as I can remember, I knew my brain worked differently. Um, but what I told him was, I’m like, the problem was, I thought it worked differently than every other person on the planet, right? So, I had to go it alone and figure it out myself. So, once you know, in communication with him and even before he started Tactical, we had these ongoing dialogues and conversations about what he was learning, you know, the, the fact that I wasn’t alone in it, that there is a community and that I, some of my challenges are pretty normal. Um, and I think it was why coach was a good fit for me, truthfully, I mean but, you know, to go from feeling isolated and that you’ve got to deal with stuff on your own and yeah. So, in Strategic Coach, Dan Sullivan, obviously it’s his program, uh, Dan and Babs, and, um, you know, there’s estimates that over half the entrepreneurs in there have ADHD. But I think the funny thing is, is we’re kind of unemployable. Like I wouldn’t hire me as an employee.

MARK WRIGHT 51:28

André has said this.

JOHN WARKENTIN 51:30

Yeah. And I look at my kids and they’re both entrepreneurs, so to speak. And it’s like, the best way I can relate this to you is something that I learned from André. It’s like neurotypical people are importance based people. So, if something’s important to you, or it’s important to somebody you care about, or some organization you care about, and you’re neurotypical, meaning you’re not on the spectrum. Um, that will be motivation for you to focus and work on something to get it done. ADHD people are interest-based people. So, we don’t have a problem focusing. We don’t have a problem being motivated. We have a problem with those two things when it isn’t interesting to us. So, the default, the things that get us off our butt is if something is interesting, new or novel, you know, uh, and challenging. And if none of those things work, our default becomes urgency. So, if something’s important to, for me to get done, but I’m not interested in it, I procrastinate, leave it till the end, and then get it done as quickly as possible, which never turns out to be your best work, um, and it doesn’t show, you know, it doesn’t put your best foot forward. Um, the problem with this, if this is true, and this is something that André and I have been discussing for the last few months is, every organization in the world is based around importance. So, if you take the school system, the school system decides, what subjects we’re supposed to, we’re supposed to learn, how we’re supposed to learn them, how the day is supposed to be structured. Um, and because it’s told to us that it is important and we’re supposed to do this, that is supposed to be motivating for us to do the work, get the marks and move on. It doesn’t matter whether it’s a family unit, which is built around importance, or if it’s your religious organization, or it’s your traditional job. All, all group formats are built around importance, or at least this is my perception. Now when you take someone who’s interest based, who isn’t motivated, or can’t focus based on importance, and you put them in an organization where that is an expectation, it becomes a conflict and you’re perceived in a way. So for instance, if I leave something that’s important to our family, to the last minute get it done and it’s mediocre, or I forget something. A neurotypical person is going to perceive me as not caring. The two are independent. I can care about something and still not be motivated to get it done because it doesn’t trigger my interest based nervous system. And so, what happens is when you look at why entrepreneurs are largely, uh, or have a higher percentage of ADHD in their population, I’m an entrepreneur because I can create my, my business. I can create my value proposition around what interests me. I’m interested in egg. I’m interested in buildings and helping those tenants. I’m interested in my customers and my other one. And so, I can create my life around things that interest me. Instead of me working for you and try and fit into your, your importance, um, environment. So, I, I think the two are directly linked.

MARK WRIGHT 55:11

Boy, that’s very well said, John. Um, and just so illuminating, uh, and you’re right, that reaction from, neurotypical people is like, what do you, you don’t care. You put this off to the last minute. Don’t you care about this? That’s really, really interesting. Um, I would love to wrap things up, John. And this has been so rich, uh, and, and, and valuable. When we talked to a while back, uh, you said something that really resonated with me. And that is one of the biggest things that you’ve realized in your working life is that a lot of the world looks at work as something you trade time for money, right? That that’s, that’s the, that’s the model. And what you’ve realized in your work and in your life is that creating value for others and getting rewarded for that is a much better model to work from, because you’re helping more people, but also you’re like, you know, when you look at the legacy that you’re able to leave your kids and the wealth that you’re able to build, and, and just the fact that you’re not having to keep an eye on the clock thinking, oh, is it time to work? Is it time to stop working? Um, it’s, it’s more of a lifestyle, but I’d love you to speak to that concept, uh, John. And that epiphany that you had that it’s not just trading time for money.

JOHN WARKENTIN 56:32

Yeah, and I think honestly, it was an epiphany in a kind of a reverse way. I didn’t realize that other people didn’t think that way. So, when you grow up in an entrepreneur, entrepreneurial family, and you’ve never really had a job, or at least any that you enjoyed, and you’re an entrepreneur, it, you know, it’s pretty simple when you’re an entrepreneur. I mean, you eat what you kill. You either create value, get paid, or you have no money, and you have to do something else. Uh, so it becomes very, that connection becomes real. But as I thought it through, trying to explain it to staff or friends, every human being gets paid. If it’s, if your pay is sustainable, every human being gets paid for value they create for another human being. Because if you don’t create value at some point, you’re not going to get paid unless somebody doesn’t realize you’re not creating any value. Um, and I think when you, when you look at people, they get hung up on this trading time for money and miss the piece that they need to create value to get paid. If, if things don’t work out, it’s the employer’s fault. If you create enough value, you’re going to get paid. Um, now industries are different. I mean, if you’re a nurse and you’re in a union, you can create all the value you want. You might not get a raise. That’s just the nature of that industry. But if you’re going to spend whatever time it is there, if you focus on creating value for other people, in all likelihood, you will get compensated more monetarily. But the intrinsic rewards of creating value for other people, um, is you know, it’s the whole giving concept where whether you give a little bit or give a lot, it does trigger different brain chemicals that make you feel better about who you are and what you do. Uh, most people want to help other people. Um, and just changing that mindset where creating value in your workday, wherever that is or whatever that, um, and focusing on that, it puts you in control of your scenario much more than making it a organization or a boss problem. So, if you’ve got to, you know, if there’s, I tell my kids this repeatedly and I’ll share with you, but the only sure way to improve your life is to improve yourself. It’s the only 100 percent success. So, if you’re not happy at your work, and I mean, I’ve had enough tough days as an entrepreneur, if he comes right back to looking at what piece you contribute to that problem, being honest with it. Another Strategic Coach concept is all progress starts with telling the truth. So, be honest about what, you know, what you contributed to the situation that’s making you unhappy. Uh, and then working on things that you can do to improve yourself. Um, and creating more value. Um, I mean, really in an entrepreneur world, it’s not quite the same as an employee, but the only way I get paid more is to help more people or create more value for the people I am help. It’s, it’s the only way I get paid more. So, if I want to expand my wealth, um, make more money. It, it all has to do with value. Um, the minute you, there are, I mean, I’m not going to say there aren’t business people out there that are probably providing all the value they should for what they’re charging, but I don’t think those are sustainable. If we look at the, you know, the businesses that have gone bankrupt, the big high profile ones, I mean, a lot of it had to do with not creating the value they were telling you that they were creating. Um, but I really think, especially for employees, there’s this detach from looking at what they have to do to create value, to get paid, and not just call it punching the clock and expecting, you know, those expectations and those, I guess, job performance requirements to be laid out in front of them. Um, because every employee that I’ve ever had sees things from a different point of view than I do. And when they bring things to me, where they think we can add value to customers, that’s, those are the little pieces of gold that help move our businesses forward.

MARK WRIGHT 01:00:54

Yeah. When everybody has that mindset. Well, John Warkentin, this has been so, uh, so much fun. And, uh, I’ve learned a ton and so encouraged about the lessons that you’ve learned and taught through your kids, through the family business and through their lives in your life. Um, this has been so much fun. I hope we can keep in touch. Um, it’s been really enjoyable and, uh, just you’re helping all of us see work in a new light and that’s what this podcast is all about. So, John, thank you.

JOHN WARKENTIN 01:01:24

Yeah, no, it has been great. I mean, it is, it’s hard to know until we talk to people like you, how other people view things, but um, sometimes a different perspective, uh, can help people. And like I told you, when I agreed to be on here, I mean, if, if there is things we can share that do help people, I don’t mind helping them.

MARK WRIGHT 01:01:41

Yeah. Yeah. Well, from one farmer to another. Thank you, John. I hope we can keep in touch.

JOHN WARKENTIN 01:01:46

We’ll do. Yep. No, we should. Thank you. Take care.

MARK WRIGHT 01:01:50

I’m Mark Wright. Thanks for listening to BEATS WORKING, part of the WORKP2P family. New episodes drop every Monday. And if you’ve enjoyed the conversation, subscribe, rate, and review this podcast. Special thanks to show producer and web editor Tamar Medford. In the coming weeks, you’ll hear from our Contributors Corner and Sidekick Sessions. Join us next week for another episode of BEATS WORKING. Where we are winning the game of work.