Welcome to Sidekick Sessions, part of the BEATS WORKING podcast. It’s where we gather the team at WORKP2P and do a deep dive to bring about shared learning.
This month, we capture the learning. It’s a phrase we often use as an indicator to see what we’ve learned, how it’s changed us, and how we can use it to redeem work. So, what have we learned over the past year or so?
Our WORKP2P sidekicks are Alysse Bryson, VP of community development; Tamar Medford, show producer; Elan Olsen, creative sidekick; Libby Sundgren, content development manager; and BEATS WORKING host Mark Wright.
The crazy part for all of us is there are no concrete job descriptions at WORKP2P, just a directive from our founder, Dan Rogers, to be ourselves and be awesome.
So, the team is here…and here we go!
Resources from the episode:
- Learn more about BEATS WORKING and our mission to redeem work here.
- Get to know our Sidekicks and find ways to connect with them here.
- Send your feedback and suggestions to host Mark Wright at mark@beatsworking.show.
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Transcript
The following transcript is not certified. Although the transcription is largely accurate, in some cases it is incomplete or inaccurate due to inaudible passages or transcription errors. The information contained within this document is for general information purposes only.
Speakers: Alysse Bryson, Elan Olsen, Tamar Medford, Libby Sundgren, and Mark Wright
ALYSSE BRYSON 00:00
In our space, we don’t have job descriptions, and we don’t really have anyone telling us what to do. It’s like, go out and break stuff, go out and make stuff, go out and build community. And, uh, let me know what you need when you figure out what you want to do. That’s wild to me. That’s wild to me. And it’s uncomfortable. Like a lot of it, I’ve been so uncomfortable in the last year and a half, but I’ve also been really, really happy.
MARK WRIGHT 00:28
This is the BEATS WORKING show. We’re on a mission to redeem work – the word, the place, and the way. I’m your host, Mark Wright. Join us at winning the game of work. Welcome to Sidekick Sessions, part of the BEATS WORKING podcast. This is where we gather the team at WORKP2P and do a deep dive to bring about shared learning. So, this month we capture the learning. So, this is a phrase we often use as an indicator to see what we’ve learned, how it’s changed us, and how we can use it to redeem work. So, what have we learned over the past year or so? You know, the crazy part for all of us here is that there are no job descriptions at WORKP2P. Just a directive from our founder, Dan Rogers, to be ourselves, and to be awesome. So, the team is here and here we go. Welcome to BEATS WORKING. On the show this month, this is another edition of Sidekick Sessions. This is where we gather the team responsible for putting content together at WORKP2P, and we do a deep dive on a topic. And we thought it would be interesting since we’re a little over a year into our work together. That we kind of retrospectively take a look at what we’ve learned in the last 12, 13, 14 months. So, we’ve got the team assembled. Capture the learning is a concept that we embrace as an organization. So today we’re going to capture the learning. What does it mean to redeem work? And how are we redeeming work withing our own company. So, let’s start by introducing the team. Elan.
ELAN OLSEN 02:05
Hey, Mark. I’m Elan Olsen. I am the creative sidekick. So, I develop all of our social media assets or anything that you see visually related to the BEATS WORKING show.
MARK WRIGHT 02:17
All right, Alysse.
ALYSSE BRYSON 02:18
Thanks, Mark. I’m Alysse Bryson and I oversee community development.
MARK WRIGHT 02:23
And Tamar.
TAMAR MEDFORD 02:25
Hey, everyone. Nice to be here. My name is Tamar Medford and I’m the producer at WORKP2P.
MARK WRIGHT 02:31
All right. And Libby.
LIBBY SUNDGREN 02:33
Hey team, Libby Sundgren here. I, uh, do content development for WORKP2P.
MARK WRIGHT 02:40
Okay. So, capture the learning. I’ve been looking forward to this because as we’ve all said, this is kind of the craziest, most exciting, interesting sort of work that any of us has done. Three of us have backgrounds in television, so this is very different from, from producing television content. Um, so I’d love to open it up and I’d love to start with Elan to talk about what you’ve learned over the past year, Elan.
ELAN OLSEN 03:10
Well, I, feel like one of the biggest things that’s maybe I haven’t learned in the last year, but that’s really resonated with me in the last year is an internal concept at WORKP2P about how businesses run. So, we think of businesses as running with three different kinds of people at the helm. So, the make it up people, the make it real people, and the make it recur people. And I’ve just kind of been on a journey of discovering which one I am. I’ve worn a couple different hats with WORKP2P, um, and done a bunch of different things. So, I feel like the learning is, is real with that. So little bit of background on the verbiage there, is make it up would be like a visionary, a CEO, the big ideas person, um, somebody that’s driving the R and D in a normal company. Um, the make it real people would be like Alysse Bryson. So, people that can take those big, hairy, audacious ideas from the visionary, make it up person and actually put some meat around that skeleton and make things actually come alive. Now, where that goes is to the make it recur people, which would be myself. Which I finally feel like I’ve landed on. And those are the people that are going to take what’s been made real and make it so anybody can do it. Make sure it recurs. So, I think that’s kind of a revelation. I think it sounds simple, but it’s very nuanced. And as somebody who has struggled with finding out what I am over a three-year period, I know that it’s very nuanced. So, where I really found that it made a lot of sense to me is another concept that we have at WORKP2P is looking at your life holistically. I’m not just work Elan. I’m not just home Elan. I’m not just wife Elan. I am not just excellent cat mom Elan. I am all of those things all at once, all of the time. So being taught that with other tools that we use at WORKP2P, I definitely make things recur elsewhere in my life. If I’m looking at Elan as a whole person, I’m the one that leaves you a list when you’re watching my house, or, um, I make the spreadsheets when we’re planning the girls’ trips and things like that. So that has been, um, a huge revelation, a lot of learning, a lot of discovering that I was wrong and letting go of what I thought was right before, um, all very quickly. So, uh, it’s been a transformative experience for sure.
MARK WRIGHT 06:01
That’s really cool. Make it up, make it real, make it recur. Alysse, do you have anything to add to that? You’ve, you’ve been close to the source code for quite a while now.
ALYSSE BRYSON 06:10
I definitely identify as a, a make it real person. However, I’m pretty good at tap dancing over in the make it up land. So, I feel like I’m a little bit bilingual between those two spaces, but I am so far away from make it recur. It’s ridiculous. Like leave a spreadsheet for people watching my house of things to do that literally never occurred to me. So like, um, I, I don’t like to check boxes. I don’t like anything that is systematic or repetitive, um, I really thrive in the new, um, uh, things outside the box that are challenging and I, that I get to make up, but then I also have to figure out like, but how do I make this real? How do I make it actually happen? Um, and so I loved, listening to Elan talk through her process of what she’s experienced. It’s also been very interesting to watch as her coworker, watch her go through the evolution process of figuring out how to take the WORKP2P source code and make it her own. Um, and, and I, of course, love the idea of just having the one life that, um, and all the ways that she said, um, and so for me, I, I’m just me all the time in all the same places. And whether I work on a Tuesday night, a Wednesday morning, or a Saturday afternoon, like it makes no difference to me. I just, I love what I do in all the different spaces that I do it. And I don’t ever, I can’t remember the last time I like checked a clock or thought about logging in or logging out at a certain time. My brain just doesn’t work that way. So, um, I’ve enjoyed a lot of those, um, things for sure. And there’s just been, uh, we have a lot of sayings at WORKP2P. Um, one of them is make mistakes at full speed. And I think I have definitely done that well over the last year and a half. I feel like I have really done a great job at making a ton of mistakes as fast as I could. And, um, some of them work, right? Some of them didn’t work. Um, I, I, I am having an experience with trying to shake off 25ish years in Corporate America and do things in a completely different way. The idea of working at 80% instead of 180% Is so confusing for me. Um, and I’m really trying to shake off that feeling of, but when’s the other shoe going to drop, and I have to prove my worth and I have to do this, and I have to do that, um, when none of those things are being asked of me. And so, I have found in the last year and a half of, of doing this WORKP2P shuffle and dance and figuring out what should go where and how I show up and when I show up and what that looks like is that I. I don’t know anything. I feel like I know less, but I’m achieving more. And I don’t know how to explain that both those things can be true. Um, and, but on most days, when I, when somebody asks me what I do, I’m like, I don’t even know how to possibly explain that to you. And even if I did, you wouldn’t even believe me cause that just sounds crazy and that it can’t be true. Um, but I really could not be happier with where I’m at right now in my professional career, and I’m really excited about the future, but please don’t ask me where I’m going to be in six months or a year or three years. I kind of have a map, but it is a very loose map, and it could change at any time. And so, we’re given a lot of tools, um, at WORKP2P to work on ourselves, which is a really big different differentiator from the other companies that I’ve worked at.
MARK WRIGHT 10:02
Elan, you also said, um, the AI explosion is something that’s really been a source of learning for you. And I know for a number of people on the team, AI is creating new opportunities to, to do work in a completely different way. Why don’t you break down what you’ve learned that way?
ELAN OLSEN 10:20
Man, I, there’s just so much available already. And We’ve barely scratched the surface. So right now, I’m kind of new in a role of exploring AI. So that’s what I’m doing is I’m exploring. I don’t have a map. I’m asking chatGPT to help me learn in an efficient way. Um, so just my main takeaways is AI is not going to go anywhere. It’s, you know, Pandora’s box is open. So, we, it behooves us to, to learn how to harness it in a way that is both useful and ethical. So that is a focus that I’m thinking about as I’m learning all of these new tools. Um, so I love chatGPT, you know, I, I volunteer with teenagers, and they are very against AI. Um, especially in creative spaces. They’re very concerned about the lack of opportunity for artistics and creatives as AI moves along. And so that’s also something that I’m thinking about. So again, I think it is one of those world altering technologies like the internet, like the car, like the wheel that revolutionized the way that we do work, the way that we do life. And, you know, I, I love being able to tell my elementary school teachers you were wrong. I always have a calculator in my pocket. So, you know, just those things that we don’t expect. I’m excited to see what that brings. I’m aware of the caution that’s needed. Um, but I think that’s a really exciting new way to do exactly what Alysse was talking about is to work less, but achieve more, and achieve better.
MARK WRIGHT 12:23
Tamar, I know you’ve been using a lot of AI to produce podcasts and to create the products surrounding those. Why don’t you explain that?
TAMAR MEDFORD 12:32
Yeah. In terms of AI, I think that, you know, I’ve been utilizing AI because I actually will ask AI on, you know, what’s the, the 10 best qualities for a podcast host to have, and asking it to help me create prompts in a program that we use that’s AI based that can really help us basically train podcast hosts, right? And pull the gold from each of the episodes that we record for the various shows that we record. And it’s so cool what it will put out. But of course, you get out of it what you put into it, so it’s not a matter of just typing in a prompt and asking for something, you have to get really specific, you have to tell it, you know, you have to basically train AI to give you an output that you’re looking for, and that has taken some time, but wow, like, what an opportunity to make the shows that we produce even better by capturing what we’re learning in each and every show.
MARK WRIGHT 13:34
That’s awesome. Anybody else want to chime in?
ALYSSE BRYSON 13:37
I think the one thing I’ll chime in about AI is a year and a half ago, I’d heard of it. I was kind of paying attention to headlines on LinkedIn and whatnot, but I was like, I don’t need that. I can’t, I don’t need that. Um, and then as someone who’s been in traditional media for over 25 years and a big book nerd since, for as long as I can remember, I was like, no, it has to be real people writing. Like, you can’t take the jobs away from the real people. Um, and now a year and a half later, I use it every day, many, many, many times throughout the day. Um, I actually don’t know. I, I, I would not want to go backwards. Um, and it’s every time I, I get blown away by something it can do. It’s not every day anymore that I’m just like, oh my God, this is the coolest thing ever. But when it still does happen, um, I am just like, this is so amazing. Not because it’s doing my work for me. It is compressing time. Tamar really talked a lot about it. It’s about what you train it. It’s about the prompts and it compresses time so that I can spend my time in places that I actually want to spend more time thinking about my thinking. We talk about that a lot at work is what, you know, stop and think about what you’re thinking about. And so, I love it from that aspect. How much more I will infuse it into my own life, I don’t know. I’m not usually, I’m not currently using it to respond to emails. I’m not currently using it to schedule my calendar or things like that. It’s definitely not picking up the dog poop in the backyard, but you know, I’m open to keep trying and testing different tools on how it can make the mundane jobs in my life less or non-existent so I can focus on the really cool stuff that gets me excited.
MARK WRIGHT 15:31
We’re using Cast Magic and AI Engine. And, uh, you know, like for the podcast for BEATS WORKING, we do a, you know, half hour pre interview just to set up things and then we’ll feed that into Cast Magic and ask it to organize things. And I’ve been really impressed with, sometimes there are some really nuanced things in a conversation that, that, that engine can pick up on and understand, and then sort of, restate that in the synopsis of the conversation, which I just find amazing. And it just makes me wonder if, if this is how good AI is now, um, imagine five years from now, what it’s going to be like 10 years, what it’s going to be like, it’s just going to be unbelievable. Libby, I’d love to ask you about what you’ve learned over the past year. One of the things you said was it’s okay to make mistakes and fail as long as we’re trying and learning. That’s progress.
LIBBY SUNDGREN 16:22
Yeah, I mean, I just, you know, I think I really cut my teeth, um, in my career in an environment where it was most usually not okay to make a mistake. You needed to be right, and it needed to be the best decision ever. And if it wasn’t, you, um, you knew it. Um, you know, just from the feedback and the vibe of the office. And it was a very, um, you know, in some ways it really, um, um, fueled my, um, attention to like quality and detail. Um, but not always in a good way. Um, sometimes in a very, um, you know, you get paralyzed sometimes when you’re like, I don’t think I can make this decision without all of these people weighing in because my, you can’t make a mistake, so you can’t always feel like you can really trust your own judgment. Um, and it might just be something that’s, um, you know, for media, um, in general, because, you know, you don’t want to put out the wrong information and you are, um, you know, seeing, reaching so many people. And, um, you know, you don’t, you want to be a credible source and not that anything that we’ve done, any mistakes I’ve made here makes us a non-credible source. Um, but I think that what I’ve been encouraged to do is just to try my ideas without waiting for everybody else to weigh in and approve it and just see what happens and if it doesn’t work, it’s okay. I’m not going to get yelled at. I’m not going to have to do the walk of shame after the team meeting. It’s going to be fine. And I’m um, you know, we’ll just try something else and at least you learned what didn’t work. And I just have not worked in an environment that really, um, you know, fostered that kind of, um, learning style for employees because, um, yeah, I just haven’t, haven’t really been allowed to make mistakes, um, and feel good about myself. So, I think that has been, um, a very, a very cool experience. Uh,
MARK WRIGHT 19:00
Yeah, yeah. Uh, don’t wait for perfection. Make mistakes at full speed. That’s what our boss, Dan Rogers, says. And that is a very freeing mindset to not always be looking over your shoulder. Cause when do we learn the most when we make mistakes, right? Success doesn’t teach us very much. Um, anybody else want to weigh on that? Mistakes? Tamar.
TAMAR MEDFORD 19:22
Uh, yeah, I’m so glad you mentioned that, because I, I too come from an environment where if you tried something and made a mistake, you got in trouble for trying something without asking it, but they always encouraged you to do new things. So, you kind of felt like you were trapped, like, you know, you had people telling you, go for it, try to do something, but then you’d get in trouble for not. You know, running it by the powers that be. And I remember last year, and I can’t remember what the mistake I made was, but like, I was close to tears. And I remember Alysse pulling me on a call and saying, this is a safe place for you to make mistakes. And no one in, you know, the almost 20 plus years I’ve been in corporate has ever said those words to me. She’s like, we don’t expect you to do everything perfect, right? But that was a standard that I had put on myself as a result of being part of corporate, you know, corporations that requested so much of you, right? And didn’t let you make mistakes at full speed. So, when I, when she told me that I was like, okay, it’s okay, you know? And it’s given me the courage, like Libby said, to try new things and if they don’t work out, that’s okay.
MARK WRIGHT 20:36
Libby, one of the things that you said you’ve learned in the past year is the difference between quality and quantity. Um, I think this is something that’s universal to every job, right? We can get it done really fast or we can get it done really well. But how have you, how have you struck that balance?
LIBBY SUNDGREN 20:53
Yeah, it’s, it’s just like you said, there is a, a real desire to produce quality content, um, whether that’s. What we’re doing or you know folks in other parts of WORKP2P are doing. Um just to make whatever work that we’re doing the best work that it can be. Um, you know, which means we don’t take on 15 or 20 clients. We don’t try and stretch ourselves so that we’re working 80 hours a week to fulfill all of these um commitments. We’re really just focused on fewer projects. And, um, you know, I think it’s also part of the, um, you know, capturing the learning and making mistakes at full speed, just really trying to get the process right, um, and to, to make things that are, meaningful, um, and useful to people. Um, you know, one thing we talk about a lot is not over producing. Um, it doesn’t mean you’re doing the bare minimum, but is what you’re doing really necessary? Is it really helping you? Is it helping what you’re doing? Is it helping your teammates? Um, and how much is it helping? You know, yes, it might be kind of helpful, but if it’s not creating real value, um, for yourself and for the people around you, then maybe it’s something that you can, you don’t really need to be doing, um, and that we shouldn’t be spending time on. And I think that’s, um, you know, goes back to our quality over quantity. We want to be creating value, whether that’s internally or externally. Um, and so focusing more on what we’re doing, as opposed to how much we’re doing really lets us do that.
MARK WRIGHT 22:48
That makes total sense. And Tamar, that’s something you had on your list too. You talked about too much, too muchness, which I love. I love that phrase because it’s so goofy, but it’s so appropriate in describing our world is full of too much stuff in every area. So, break that down as it relates to what you’ve learned tomorrow over the past year.
TAMAR MEDFORD 23:08
Yeah, I’ve really learned that I can actually get more done by doing less, which is such a foreign concept, right? And if I, you know, and through the training that we’ve had over the last year and still continue to do, I’ve picked out things in my daily, you know, tasks that I’m like, what a waste of time. Like, why am I doing this? And I schedule my day so jam packed that I don’t get what I’d like to get done, done. And so, I started, and it was hard for me to want to strip things away. And not add all of this, because I, I like to check the box, right? I like to make sure it gets done. But I’m also a creative, so when I think of something, AI comes into my head, all of a sudden, I want to go off on this little, you know, maybe rabbit hole and dig into this, right? And we have tools now that we can actually mark that down and I can go back to it later. So, for me, it’s just slowing down sometimes and really taking a look at what’s important. What’s going to, you know, move the dial forward in my whole life, not just in my day-to-day work. Because when I do slow down, it makes things more fulfilling. I catch more. I don’t make as many mistakes, even though we’re allowed to make mistakes at full speed. But I also just, the ideas start to flow because if I have too much in my head, then that’s where the mistakes happen. I don’t come up with as many creative ideas and I can’t just go with it, right? And now at least I’m allowing myself the time in my schedule that when that stuff does pop up, I can take some action on it. And it’s just going to benefit the way I do the rest of my job.
MARK WRIGHT 24:47
Hmm. That’s great. Anybody else want to chime in before we move on to the next? Yeah, Elan.
ELAN OLSEN 23:53
That was really good, Tamar, and it was making me think about, you know, some of the other concepts that we embrace at WORKP2P, which is intentional, intentional living, intentional impact. And just what you were saying, I was just reflecting on another learning that I feel like I’ve really embraced this year. We use a tool to to diagnose every single one of our tasks. And as we’ve been talking about, it’s a holistic life master list of your to do items. So, it’s not just podcast production. It’s also take care of the dogs and all that other stuff. And looking at each individual task that you have and diagnosing it without judgment, you know, it’s, if you caught a cold, you caught a cold. It’s not a moral judgment. It’s just figuring out what it is, deciding on how important, how urgent that task is. It gives you an intentional pause to really, again, what Tamar was saying, reflect on each thing and being like, Do I care enough about this to keep it on my to do list and keep it in my brain and increase my level of anxiety? Cause I know I have things on my shelf that I haven’t looked at. So that’s kind of what I was thinking about when you were saying all those things tomorrow. I really resonate with everything you said.
MARK WRIGHT 26:10
Yeah. I love that. The importance of intentionality is something that I’ve learned over this last year. I don’t think most of us in our lives think that, you know, we, we try to make good decisions and we try to make plans, but this tool, the top six that we all use is an incredible thing in that it, it causes us every day to evaluate what we’re thinking and what we’re doing and what we want to accomplish the next day. And I think there’s, there’s such value in that intentionality because stuff gets done in, in, in an amazing way. Um, anybody else want to chime in before we move on to the next topic?
ALYSSE BRYSON 26:46
I will chime in because I did just have something wild happen. Wild on my master list. My master list is quite long. That can’t come as a surprise to anyone. And it, it goes through now through 2035. Like it is there. I, I mean, there’s a lot that’s on there for like the next six months. And then there’s like bigger picture things that are like three years from now, five years from now, 10 years from now, whatever. So, I’ve been trying to spend intentional time with it for about a half an hour in the morning and a half an hour at night before I log off to get really clear and run things through my filters on should this stay on the list or not. And there were a bunch of things on the list that are just little writing projects that I, for no reason, they’re not, they’d serve no purpose. Nobody would read them. I would just enjoy writing about an experience I had here or there, or some art projects. There’s one that’s been sitting on my dining room table now since maybe the beginning of the pandemic, I’m not sure. And, um, there’s, when we diagnose things, we put them into four compartments. It’s decide, do, delegate, or delete. And I love to live in three of the four boxes, but deleting just doesn’t seem like an option, right? Because I am a person that loves more. I am a maximalist who sometimes fantasizes about being a minimalist, but it’s literally impossible for me. Um, but last, the other day I moved like 10 things to delete. Now I didn’t actually delete them off the list at first. I just let them move to the color, which I actually think delete is black maybe. And, um, and I was like, look at me deleting stuff. But then I was like, but I’m not really going to delete it. It’s still on the list. And then I just left it on the list as deleted for a couple of days, just to try that on, just to feel how I felt about letting these things go. And, um, a couple of days went by, and I actually deleted them. And I know that seems silly and dumb and like, it doesn’t make a difference, but it actually then made the list shorter and made my attention go onto the things that I actually know are so much, so much more important and will move the needle in my life so much further. So, um, it’s, it’s interesting to me as someone who has practice using this tool not perfectly, uh, and sometimes I’ve like fallen off for a couple weeks at a time and then had to get back on, um, because I, uh, unfortunately don’t, doing things consistently is tough for me. Um, but I have a different experience with it when I really show up to it. And I get honest with myself, there’s no one else in the tool. I mean, yes, I sent it to Dan to have him review it before we have our one-on-one meetings. Um, but he’s not, he’s only looking at it to skim it. So, he knows what we’re going to be talking about. I don’t answer to anyone other than myself. So, if I spend any time in this tool lying to myself about the reality, it’s not helping me get any further forward than I want to get forward. So for me, it’s that intentionality around confronting reality and getting really honest with myself. And for some reason, when I put it in black and white, meaning you write it down, whether it’s in a spreadsheet or in a journal, when you make it real in black and white with words. It becomes more real. It pulls it out of my brain. And Dan talks a lot about the whole reason behind the master list and pulling all these things out of your brain is that then you don’t have to worry about, oh, I might forget something. Because you’ve captured all of it into this list and then it can just sit there until you decide what you want to do with it. And in this particular example, I decided to delete several activities. Which means that art project is going to sit on my dining room table a little bit longer. But I’m okay with that. I’m okay with that.
MARK WRIGHT 30:27
That’s awesome. One thing I’d like to talk about with you all is what one of the things that Dan says is the universe is a pull, not a push. And I really struggled with this over the past year because, well, what it essentially means is that if you push your agenda on the world, you’re only going to get so far. But if you act in a way that’s that is inherently interesting and has value. It, it will attract people to you and things to you. And this is diametrically opposed to. Alysse, we worked in television, and I mean, tonight at 11, I mean, that, that was what we said day after day after day. We’re pushing, we’re pushing and it’s highly ineffective because when was the last time you saw one of these promos on TV, you know, man, decapitated on I five, the story at 11. It’s like, I don’t want to watch that. But, and just, but getting my head around this idea of the universe as a pole has been really a fun and at times frustrating transformation. But at least I’d love your thoughts on this because this is something that, and Libby as well, we’re all from TV and this is not what the TV world does.
ALYSSE BRYSON 31:33
Um, I don’t even watch TV anymore. Is that okay to say out loud? Like, I don’t remember the last time I watched news. Um, so I don’t even remember the promos. Um, but yeah, but yes, I, I definitely know about being in a push environment. I was in advertising for 25 years. That is push, push, push, push, push, push, push, right? And then wait, I got to push some more. Um, I used to have a joke as a salesperson that I keep calling until they get a restraining order. Um, and I kind of actually, you know, all jokes are kind of true. Like I kind of actually meant it. Like, if you don’t tell me, no, I’ll keep calling. And if you do tell me, no, I’ll call and try to talk you out of it. So, um, so that has been a very interesting and different way to approach things. However, Dan pointed out to me that, uh, with my project, the Sober Curator that I launched during the pandemic, for whatever reason, my mindset around that project has followed the WORKP2P source code exactly. I don’t do any push. I have not ever recruited a Sober Curator. I don’t spend money on ads. Um, I do publish the things on the website and then push them out on the social media channels because it’s a necessary evil, but most of the traffic to the site comes from search, like, like a significant amount, like 80%. And, um, that project is now three and a half years old, and it is, it’s in its, uh, toddler years, but it’s out of the terrible twos. And, um, right now, last week, we had our monthly business meeting. And let me be clear, they’re all volunteers. I don’t, I’m not paying any of them to do anything. We’re all just working on creating this really incredible hub of lifestyle content that is, uh, curated specifically for the people in the alcohol-free recovery communities. And, uh, we had the most significant business meeting. I think we’ve ever had to Mark and back me up on this. And it was interesting because normally we start the meeting off by everyone chiming in on what they’re working on, what’s new with them. Uh, and then we go around the room and everybody just talks about themselves, and that’s fun. And we all have egos, so that works. And, but for this last meeting, I gave the homework assignment of everybody read somebody else’s work and come prepared for the meeting. to talk about somebody else’s work and what you liked out of it, um, all in a very positive way. And I was like, is this assignment, first of all, are they going to do it? Second of all, is everybody going to read the same one article by one person? And then it’s going to look like favoritism, like how will I make sure the love is equal? Like I got all wrapped up in my brain and then I just like let go and to see what would happen. And it was beautiful. I, I think I shed a tear or two, which I think unfortunately has been documented on the Zoom recording. But, um, but that is pull. And when, when, there’s nothing stronger than pull, right? There just isn’t. Um, when someone is trying to tell me what to do, I don’t usually like it, but when I’m doing what I want to do, it’s a totally different game, right? And we see that with our children. Uh, and we see that into adulthood. Dan also likes to say that everything’s backwards. And at first I was like, no, it’s just you, man. You’re backwards. But I actually, he’s not wrong. He’s not wrong about so many things and, um, I think the last year and a half for me, the struggle has been, um, well, this can’t be right. This can’t be this way. And you, what do you know what you’re talking about? And, but the back of his baseball card shows that he has figured some things out in the last 30 years. So instead of questioning why it’s wrong or why it won’t work, at some point, a few months back, I just, I broke, and I was like, I give up. I’m riding too many saddles with one ass. And let’s be clear, I have a big ass, but it’s still one saddle, right? You just can’t spread yourself so thin. You’re not doing any good anywhere. And so, I threw up the white flag and I said, I give up. You’re right. I’m doing too much in too many places. I’m not doing any of it. Well, I give up. You’re right. And then please, I hope that wasn’t on recording. Cause, cause he doesn’t need to hear that he’s right. Like he knows he’s right, but he is right. And, and, and so it’s this, this trying to trust, sometimes it feels like blind faith, but like all faith is relatively blind, I think, and just trust the process and just be like, I can keep doing what I’ve always done, and I’ll keep getting what I always got, or I can approach everything differently. I’ve been given this opportunity to do work in a completely different way that is super uncomfortable, very confusing, and I feel like I’m doing it wrong more than I’m doing it right. Um, but an, a year and a half in of not giving up, that’s it. Just not dying and not giving up. I think I’m making progress. And so, I don’t know if you all got something out of that, but, um, it has definitely been not boring.
MARK WRIGHT 36:32
That’s awesome. Well, as we wrap things up. I’d love to ask one final question of you all, and that is just simply about redeeming work and how work has been redeemed in your life over the past year, year and a half. Tamar.
TAMAR MEDFORD 36:49
I think for me. I look at work in a whole new way. I used to, you know, get ready to wind down on a Sunday night and just feel that anxiety in my chest, and just, you know, ugh. And I would actually open my emails in advance so that it wasn’t as, you know, uh, tough to take in on a Monday morning and just knowing what’s coming at you and to have the opportunity to learn from everything you do and that’s encouraged, right? To make mistakes at full speed and just to like shine in your own light, right? I’ve always, there’s always been titles and people you have to report to and WORKP2P is completely different. You know, it’s redeeming work. I don’t look at work as work anymore. Like I can’t, there’s no Monday in the last year and a half or year and a bit that I’ve woke up feeling sick to my stomach because I’m going to get yelled at by someone, or I’m going to get in trouble or, you know, there’s too many emails to handle. Um, and that’s a really cool feeling. And to be able to use my creativity here is just like it blows my mind and just I feel like I’m finally at that point like Alysse said right that happened to her at the end of last year where I’m just embracing this and I’m like okay you know I gotta give up on these old ideas. So, just the whole way I look at work is different, and I think that, um, it’s just a whole lot more fun.
ALYSSE BRYSON 38:19
I just want to jump, I just want to jump in on the yelling part, because there actually has been quite a bit of yelling, at least in my experience. But it’s a different kind of yelling, I would like to clarify. It’s a yelling of passion, or fighting for something. Um, it’s a different type of yelling, uh, and so I, I just wanted to jump in on that. And I’m sure I have been one of the yellers, because as we all know, I naturally project, and I can’t help myself.
MARK WRIGHT 38:46
Libby, how about you?
LIBBY SUNDGREN 38:48
You know, I think, um, having, um, a boss like Dan and working for a company, the way that, um, he runs his company, it just makes you excited to work, and it doesn’t make me excited to work in the sense that I feel like I should be working all the time. Um, I just, you know, he, he wants to run his business the way that normal people think. They just are too afraid to do it. If it’s, whether it’s push-pull or, making sure you definitely shut off so that you go do, um, you know, take care of your personal life or, um, you know, not being afraid to make mistakes. He just, the, the things he does are very logical and the, you know, kind of the rules that we live by aren’t crazy. They’re just things that, um, aren’t typical in, in a corporate setting. Um, and it’s just really refreshing to, to work for someone and with people, you know, with a team like this, where, um, you know, we, we just collectively want, um, to like what we’re doing, um, and, and do a good job.
MARK WRIGHT 40:13
Elan.
ELAN OLSEN 40:14
Well, I would say it’s kind of all of it. I think being given the tools to look at your life holistically, ride your one saddle of life with your one ass, you know, um, and the permission to be thinking about who you are in your whole life, in your whole saddle, um, bringing that to work and having that be valued, celebrated, and desired as part of a reason why you are working for the company that you’re working for. Um, I think my most recent instruction from Dan was to go break stuff. So, I think, you know, any part of my job description being written by Limp Bizkit definitely speaks directly to my millennial soul. So, you know, I, I think work has genuinely been redeemed for me in a way that, you know, I’m in the infancy of my career, I’ve dipped a toe in the water of customer service and very minimally in a corporate world, and it looks and feels different than what I expected, and, you know, being able to be fully Elan everywhere is super liberating, and not feeling shame about being fully Elan at work, because I know that’s, you know, why they keep me around because I, I do do that. So, I feel like in general work has been redeemed by removing the idea that there is a work life balance. I’m just looking at my life.
MARK WRIGHT 41:52
That’s very well said. Alysse, how about you?
ALYSSE BRYSON 41:56
Well, you know, this isn’t the kind of place for someone that needs a job description to do their job or needs to be told what to do. And that can be a little bit frustrating because, uh, and I’ll just speak for myself as a people pleaser. Like if I know what you want me to do that, I can make sure that I achieve it and go, you know, however much over that I want to as an overachiever. But in our space, we don’t have job descriptions. Um, and we don’t really have anyone telling us what to do. It’s like, go out and break stuff, go out and make stuff, go out and build community. And, uh, let me know what you need when you figure out what you want to do. And that’s wild to me. That’s wild to me. And it’s uncomfortable. Like a lot of it, I’ve been so uncomfortable in the last year and a half, but I’ve also been really, really happy. Um, so many parts of the time, and so, and for me, and Mark, you touched on this at the beginning of this episode, like when I make mistakes is where I learn the most, the most beautiful things have come out of the most awful things in my life, right? The most, the worst mistakes I’ve had, the worst things that have happened to me have. All been the birthplace of the amazing things that happened. And so, I don’t want a comfortable life. That’s not where I’m at now. Ask me again when I’m in my sixties, I might want a comfortable life in my sixties, but right now I want a big, hairy, audacious life. I want something crazy that no one believe could ever happen. And I want to look back and be like, that was a, that was a ride. In one saddle, right? In one saddle. So,
MARK WRIGHT 43:38
Well, I think you’re onto something with that Sober Curator, Alysse. Got my fingers crossed. That’s going to be so fun to watch that grow and develop. And as Alysse said, that’s the craziest thing. Dan’s told us, hey, if you’re looking for a job description, you’re not going to find it here. And that is a little unsettling at times, but I, I mean, going back to what, um, Ilan said, you know, Dan told me, I want two things from you, be Mark and be awesome. And, uh, I, and that’s, that’s the, essentially the job description. If, if, if I needed one, which has a lot of freedom and a lot of responsibility, but it’s really all about growing the human being. And I think that’s, you know, if you look at how we grow as human beings, there isn’t any growth that takes place without some pain. And so, if you’re going to lift weights, if you’re going to have a baby, if you’re going to do whatever growth involves stretching and pushing and experiencing pain sometimes, but at the end you’re, you’re better, you’re better than you were before. So, you know, what I love about the BEATS WORKING podcast is we get to talk to all kinds of people who are redeeming work. They’re making work better despite a flawed system. You know, in terms of how businesses are structured, there are a lot of people doing some really amazing work just to make work not feel like work for the people under their employment. So I’m inspired to keep up that work and, uh, inspired to work with all of you. Any final comments from anybody? The learning, the learning episode.
ALYSSE BRYSON 45:11
I hope we were recording this so that it’s all been captured.
MARK WRIGHT 45:16
I think it has. Thanks to Tamar.
TAMAR MEDFORD 45:19
It sure has.
MARK WRIGHT 45:20
Well, thanks. Thanks you all. And it’s been fun spending time with you. Appreciate the input. Onward, upward. And this has been another edition of Sidekick Sessions.
ELAN OLSEN 45:30
Thanks Mark.
MARK WRIGHT 45:31
I’m Mark Wright. Thanks for listening to BEATS WORKING, part of the WORKP2P family. New episodes drop every Monday. And if you’ve enjoyed the conversation, subscribe, rate, and review this podcast. Special thanks to show producer and web editor Tamar Medford. In the coming weeks, you’ll hear from our Contributors Corner and Sidekick Sessions. Join us next week for another episode of BEATS WORKING, where we are winning the game of work.